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To: blue-duncan; Kolokotronis; wmfights; P-Marlowe; Quix; Forest Keeper; xzins; HarleyD; Gamecock
Sin demands a sacrifice; love provided it in Jesus

No problem here. The problem is with God the Father demanding sacrifice. I was assuming you were of the opinion that He did, hence my hilarity.

We don't "arrogate" sainthood

I know Paul and others used the word differently, but the historical usage was to canonize those whose life were an exceptional example of holiness, witnessed by miracles, and call saints them and only them.

We can't do anything to "attain" holiness.

Sure we can. Through Jesus, of course, but here is the program; it has a beginning and an end, and "you shall not sin at any time" comes in the end:

3 As all things of his divine power which appertain to life and godliness, are given us, through the knowledge of him who hath called us by his own proper glory and virtue. 4 By whom he hath given us most great and precious promises: that by these you may be made partakers of the divine nature: flying the corruption of that concupiscence which is in the world. 5 And you, employing all care, minister in your faith, virtue; and in virtue, knowledge; 6 And in knowledge, abstinence; and in abstinence, patience; and in patience, godliness; 7 And in godliness, love of brotherhood; and in love of brotherhood, charity. 8 For if these things be with you and abound, they will make you to be neither empty nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 For he that hath not these things with him, is blind, and groping, having forgotten that he was purged from his old sins. 10 Wherefore, brethren, labour the more, that by good works you may make sure your calling and election. For doing these things, you shall not sin at any time.

(2 Peter 1))

I haven't seen anyone here ridiculing God or the Apostles

No, not Christ or Apostles, but the saints, presumably including the martyrs of the Church were dismissed as dead people not deserving of or not caring for our company.

6,602 posted on 01/17/2007 1:38:30 PM PST by annalex
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To: annalex; Kolokotronis; wmfights; P-Marlowe; Quix; Forest Keeper; xzins; HarleyD; Gamecock; ...

"but the saints, presumably including the martyrs of the Church were dismissed as dead people not deserving of or not caring for our company."

I have not been able to follow all of the posts on this thread so I am not familiar with this. Is this from the praying to the saints debate?


6,621 posted on 01/17/2007 1:54:12 PM PST by blue-duncan
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