Replies

Your post 6078 wasn’t clear to me, so I did some back tracking to try to figure it out:

Original challenge at 5966:

An what is a saint in your book?

My reply at 5971:

God defines a saint this way:

He shall call to the heavens from above, and to the earth, that he may judge his people. Gather my saints together unto me; those that have made a covenant with me by sacrifice. - Psalms 50:4-5

Response at 6007:

So, all the "saints" you meet have made a covenant "by sactifice?"

My reply at 6019:

Yes indeed they have:

And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins: But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God; From henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool. For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. [Whereof] the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before, This [is] the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them; And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more. Now where remission of these [is, there is] no more offering for sin. - Hebrews 10:11-18

And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. - John 3:14-15

Latest response:

Heb 10:11-18...

Look up Heb 8...whoever the author of that book is, he is saying the same thing about the "House of Israel" just two chapters before yours. Not saints, but the unbelieveing Jews.

So much for predestination and God-given faith.

Evidently the problem is that latest response raises two issues which are not “in” this sidebar thread.

First, I haven’t debated predestination on the thread. And if you had followed my previous postings on the subject, you might have noticed that I aver predestination and free will are not mutually exclusive. Both are true because God has spoken both prophesies and commandments.

Secondly, the question what is a saint? was not narrowed to Christian versus Jew. The definition I gave was from Psalms.

Jesus Christ is the way, the truth and the life – no one comes to the father except by Him. (John 14:6) But Jesus is from the beginning (John 1) and therefore, it doesn’t mean that mortals who physically lived before Jesus was enfleshed cannot be saints.

Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw [it], and was glad. Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. – John 8:56-58

Again, if you had followed my previous postings on the subject, you might have noticed that I aver God will keep all of His promises to Israel. The blood of Christ has no limitation in time, nor are the Jews precluded from Him:

Thus saith the LORD, which giveth the sun for a light by day, [and] the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar; The LORD of hosts [is] his name:

If those ordinances depart from before me, saith the LORD, [then] the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me for ever.

Thus saith the LORD; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the LORD. – Jer 31:35-37

For if the firstfruit [be] holy, the lump [is] also [holy]: and if the root [be] holy, so [are] the branches. And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree; Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.

Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in. Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: For if God spared not the natural branches, [take heed] lest he also spare not thee.

Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in [his] goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off. And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.

For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural [branches], be graffed into their own olive tree?

For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this [is] my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

As concerning the gospel, [they are] enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, [they are] beloved for the fathers' sakes. – Romans 11:16-28