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To: Blogger; annalex

"It's not what is over the door, its whether or not you have a relationship with Jesus Christ."

How, Blogger, does one have a "relationship" with God? That's so 20th century Western, 1st World of you. Where in the bible does it say that in order to fulfill our original created purpose, we need to have a "relationship" with God?

Let's assume for the moment that the original Protestants had justifiable complaints against Rome. Why in leaving and since did they and do they feel it necessary to throw out virtually every aspect of The Faith except what each of them, and don't say its otherwise, individually divines from whatever version of a translated scripture they read? None of the original reformers' complaints against Rome were applicable to Orthodoxy. Why didn't they go East? They knew the direction; they knew Orthodoxy existed. Why did they leave The Church? Wasn't it simply an overwhelming arrogance, the desire to replace the rule of Rome with the rule of the kirk and the preacher, every man a pope? Within one generation of Luther, Protestant divines at Thubingen did correspond with the Patriarch of Constantinople Joachim II. The letters are fascinating in what they show about the mindset of the Protestants only a few years after Luther's death. Their heresy and arrogance was so overwhelming that the Patriarch eventually had to tell them to go away and stop writing to him. The desire to rule is the mother of all heresies, Blogger.


3,236 posted on 12/31/2006 11:07:35 AM PST by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!)
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To: Kolokotronis

How does one have a relationship with God? The same way that Adam did. You walk and talk with Him every day. Of course, Adam sinned and broke that fellowship with God - so that the ONLY way we can have a relationship with God is through Christ Jesus' His Son. Such is not a new concept. It is as old as the Bible itself.


1 Corinthians 1:9
God, who has called you into fellowship with his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, is faithful.

2 Corinthians 13:14
May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all.

Romans 5:10
For if, when we were God's enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life!

2 Corinthians 5:18
All this is from God, who reconciled us to himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation:

Colossians 1:22
But now he has reconciled you by Christ's physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation—

John 1:12
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

Romans 8:15
For you did not receive a spirit that makes you a slave again to fear, but you received the Spirit of sonship. And by him we cry, "Abba, Father."

Galatians 4:6
Because you are sons, God sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, the Spirit who calls out, "Abba, Father."


3,239 posted on 12/31/2006 11:24:46 AM PST by Blogger
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To: Kolokotronis; Blogger; annalex
The letters are fascinating in what they show about the mindset of the Protestants only a few years after Luther's death. Their heresy and arrogance was so overwhelming that the Patriarch eventually had to tell them to go away and stop writing to him. The desire to rule is the mother of all heresies, Blogger.

And yet where is this "rule" today? We are castigated at every turn for having a million zillion denominations, and that is because we have no centralized authority. We are told that is our weakness. We are told the only way to God is to have a firm rule under men. Yet, we don't have it. Who really does have this desire to rule? The RCs do to the highest degree, and the Orthodox to a lesser degree. However, you have it to a much greater degree than we do. I know you believe that your leaders are justified in the power they wield, but my main point is that "ruling" isn't really what we're all about. We get pounded all the time by you guys because of that. :)

3,774 posted on 01/04/2007 4:36:52 AM PST by Forest Keeper
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