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To: adiaireton8
We're discussing Mary's fictitious perpetual virginity and you bring in questions about Jesus and John.

There is no Scriptural evidence for the cult that has grown up around the adoration of Mary. And there is certainly no need to believe Mary's anatomy differed from any other mother, either pre or post delivery.

The miracle is Jesus' sacrifice and resurrection. That is where Christian's should be focusing attention.


300 posted on 12/05/2006 11:13:53 PM PST by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg; adiaireton8
The miracle is Jesus' sacrifice and resurrection. That is where Christian's should be focusing attention

And the Incarnation is not a miracle? Is there anything about Christ that we should not focus on?

305 posted on 12/06/2006 3:09:18 AM PST by kosta50 (Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
We're discussing Mary's fictitious perpetual virginity and you bring in questions about Jesus and John.

Recall that Jesus was asked (Matt 21:23) "By what authority are you doing these things?" and He replied by asking a question about John the Baptist. Is it wrong to imitate my Lord? Jesus's baptism is highly relevant to understanding properly Mary's purification.

There is no Scriptural evidence for the cult that has grown up around the adoration of Mary.

First, there is no Scriptural evidence for the cult that grew up around 'sola scriptura', called Protestantism. So why are you one? Second, Catholics do not *adore* Mary in the technical sense of 'adore', for adoration is reserved for God alone.

And there is certainly no need to believe Mary's anatomy differed from any other mother, either pre or post delivery.

If Christ corrupts or injures the physical integrity of Mary, there are serious theological implications regarding the relation between grace and nature. That is part of the reason why the Fifth Ecumenical Council declared Mary "ever-virgin".

Perhaps you didn't see the irony of saying, "The miracle is Jesus' sacrifice and resurrection. That is where Christian's should be focusing attention" and following it immediately with a picture of a book about Mary.

-A8

312 posted on 12/06/2006 6:34:27 AM PST by adiaireton8 ("There is no greater evil one can suffer than to hate reasonable discourse." - Plato, Phaedo 89d)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
The miracle is Jesus' sacrifice and resurrection. That is where Christian's should be focusing attention.

That's a rather strange comment. The Incarnation is a prerequisite for the "sacrifice and resurrection"; indeed, some commentators would say that it's the initial part of the sacrifice. It's certainly one of the central mysteries of the Christian faith.

Paul seems to have no problem writing a beautiful meditation on the Incarnation in Phil 2:5-11, and another one as a major theme of the Epistle to the Hebrews.

331 posted on 12/06/2006 7:47:35 AM PST by Campion ("I am so tired of you, liberal church in America" -- Mother Angelica, 1993)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg; adiaireton8; blue-duncan; kosta50

The scriptural fact that Blue Duncan mentioned was that Mary had to undergo purification "according to the Law of Moses". It does not mean the Evangelist believed she was objectively impure, as another example of following the ritual despite the absence of objective need was the baptism of Christ, as Adiareton cogently points out.

Regardless of the physiological manner of Christ's birth, the scripture is silent on the issue of Mary loing her virginity or having other children. This is one instance when adherance to the Scripture Alone superstition would do you untold good.

It is all good for you to focus on the sacrifice and resurrection of Christ, if you do not wish to also focus on the Incarnation, the other pillar of Christian faith. One way to do so is to refrain from blaspheming the Holy Mother of God and find something positive to say, in the spirit of the, hm, "holiday" season.


341 posted on 12/06/2006 8:34:23 AM PST by annalex
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