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To: xzins; P-Marlowe; Blogger; Kolokotronis; blue-duncan; sitetest
As an Orthodox Christian, my beliefs are not confused. I call Mary the Theotokos. The Council at Ephesus dealt with well-intentioned memebrs of the Church who followed the reasoning exposed here on this thread and the Councils established that this is not the teaching of the Church. That which is not the teaching of the Church is, by definition, heresy.

I would expect those who have been, educated, familiarized, an trained in theology, as chaplains are certainly, to know that definition, and not presume by semantic gymnastics that it is anything but what the definition says.

I couldn't care less what anyone believes. I do know what is outside of the Church teaching, and that which is outside the Church teaching (such as that Mary gave birth to a man) is by definition heresy. Nestorianism and Arianism were condemned as such and those who propose the theology of Arius and Nestor are teaching heresy, by definition.

It's not personal. I didn't make up the rules and I didn't vote at the Council of Ephesus. But anyone who has issues with the Title Mary Mother of God needs to read the proceedings of that Council, imo.

1,840 posted on 12/18/2006 8:05:11 AM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: kosta50; xzins; Blogger
that which is outside the Church teaching (such as that Mary gave birth to a man) is by definition heresy.

Jesus was not a man?

1,841 posted on 12/18/2006 8:09:34 AM PST by P-Marlowe (LPFOKETT GAHCOEEP-w/o*)
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To: kosta50

None of us are proclaiming Nestorian or Arian views is the problem. You want to label us such, but we are not denying Jesus's unity as God and man. We are just disagreeing with a certain title.

Catholics and Orthodox have elevated Mary above where the Bible places her. They have given her titles of God. I dare say that if those who voted at Ephesus saw what she has become, they would throw out the topic altogether and focus Christological definitions on the titles of Christ Himself rather than on Mary.

If God didn't shield her from it, I'm sure Mary would sob with tears day and night for what is being done in her name.

I will take my chances against what the Catholic or Orthodox churches call heresy any day. I've already been anathematized because I refuse to repent and venerate icons - so why should it matter what I believe concerning views on Mary?

I take my stand on the Word of God - not man's traditions or any council's definitions. God's Word contains the essential truths I need to know. In so far as councils agree with God's Word, I am for them. Where they disagree (uh many of the things past say 400-500 AD) I believe they are following man and not God or worse.


1,844 posted on 12/18/2006 8:13:44 AM PST by Blogger
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