They would have lived happily and multiplied, just as God commanded them I suppose [in perpetuity, with no one ever physically dying].
So, then would you say that it didn't really matter to God which outcome happened, and that either could have? God just sat back and watched? I would have answered the same question by noting that it was moot because it didn't happen. What did happen was what God wanted to happen, so that is what happened. Perhaps this is a good illustration of our differing views on the level of God's control in our world.
Christ's human nature was no different than Adam's, so it too had to have a potential to sin.
I disagree because my view on this is IMPECCABLE, Jesus could not have sinned (nyuk, nyuk :). While both Adam and Jesus did not have the sin nature, Adam had only one nature and Jesus had two. Were those natures wholly separate in every respect, or were they separate, but did support each other? Was Jesus one person or two? He was one, so the natures, while not "mixing" worked together.
Besides, if Jesus could have sinned then, then He could also sin now. What is different about His essence today vs. back then? Nothing. (Col. 2:9 : For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form.) Christ is still the God-man today. But we would say if Christ sinned today it would violate His nature, so it is impossible. I wouldn't expect anyone to argue that Christ could privately use only His human nature in Heaven today to sin, so likewise He couldn't have while walking the earth.
Wrong. In order to be free, one must allow that potential.
So, for Adam and Eve to be free, God was obligated to let the serpent into the garden? OK, what about all the time in between creation and when the serpent came? Were Adam and Eve NOT free then? Were they not created free, IOW? If you say that the serpent was always free to enter, but just decided to wait, then you bely everything we know about satan and how he operates. Does he EVER just leave us believers alone? No, it is a constant attack. That scenario wouldn't fit. The serpent would have entered to hurt God and His people at the first opportunity.
They could have repented. The act that sealed their fall was their refusal to repent when caught.
I still don't get where you get this two-step process from. Apparently, you are saying that a real sin is the initial commission PLUS a failure to repent. The Bible doesn't say that. The Bible says that just sin equals death. When you ask your priest for forgiveness, and get it, do you then say to yourself: "well then I never committed that sin"? I HOPE not. :) But this is what you are saying when you say that the failure to repent "sealed" the Fall. The Fall was over and complete when Adam blew it, whether he repented right after or not. There MUST be sin before repentance even enters the picture. ....... Don't we all agree that at SOME later point Adam DID repent?
If God created Eve "ditzy" enough as you say to be easy pray then God set her up.
In a matter of speaking, YES! :) We know for sure that God, by instruction, BANNED them from the knowledge of good and evil. So, what chance did she have against real evil? I imagine she was a very trusting sort, and why not? She had never been lied to before, and couldn't possibly discern the difference. This was all by God's design.
It's no different than leading a child consciously to step into the traffic and then blame the child for getting hit.
That doesn't work unless you have the power to bring the child back to life. I'm not positive, but I assume Eve is in Heaven today. So, it's not the same. It also doesn't work because God did not coach (lead) Eve into blowing it. He did allow the traffic, but He didn't send her into it.
God gave her freedom to choose and she abused it. That's why we have lawyers.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. :)
I say that's very possible. We chose the hard way, but in the end the result will be the same.
God just sat back and watched?
No, God remained and remains very active, leading, coaching us, knocking on our hearts, showing us the way...
What did happen was what God wanted to happen, so that is what happened.
Yes, God wanted us Adam and Eve to decide. They did. He allowed it.
Perhaps this is a good illustration of our differing views on the level of God's control in our world.
I would say so.
While both Adam and Jesus did not have the sin nature, Adam had only one nature and Jesus had two.
Adam was no more compelled to sin that Christ in his human nature. It was a choice. If Christ was incapable of committing sin in his human nature than he was not the Second Adam, He was not human as God created humans, He was not true Man, but only true God, and then we fall into Nestorianism (Assyrian Church of the East).
Were those natures wholly separate in every respect, or were they separate, but did support each other? Was Jesus one person or two? He was one, so the natures, while not "mixing" worked together.
Christ's natures were never confused. Christ's human nature was always in harmony with His divine nature because, as pre-Fall Man He could choose good.
I have no clue if Christ had foreknowledge in His human nature or whether He knew that because Adam failed He must not. Frankly, Christiology is, like Trinity, above reason.
Besides, if Jesus could have sinned then, then He could also sin now.
His natures haven't changed. Pre-Fall human nature was capable of sinning. But it was also capable of rejecting sin. Christ chose perfect obedience.
Col. 2:9 : For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form.
Pauline Christology is interesting to put it mildly. One can read all sorts of things in that statement.
So, for Adam and Eve to be free, God was obligated to let the serpent into the garden?
God gave Adam and Eve freedom. he also planted to tree to remind them that their freedom is not unlimited. There was no serpent; there was only the temptation, the tree, and God put it there. The Bible calls the temptation the "serpent."
OK, what about all the time in between creation and when the serpent came?
There was no commandment, so there was no possibility of disobedience to God. Once God planted the tree and commanded that they not eat of it, the possibility for disobedience was created and the tree that was otherwise neutral became the object of temptation that Adam and Eve could not ignore.
I still don't get where you get this two-step process from.
Genesis.
Apparently, you are saying that a real sin is the initial commission PLUS a failure to repent.
They sinned when they disobeyed. When given a chance to confess and repent, they blamed someone other that themselves.
The Bible says that just sin equals death.
Of course. Rejecting God, Who is Life, is choosing death, which is absence of God. By choosing sin we choose non-existence, which is death.
When you ask your priest for forgiveness, and get it, do you then say to yourself: "well then I never committed that sin"?
First, I don't ask the priest for forgiveness, I ask God. The priest hears my confession and commiserates with me, because he commits similar sins, and he prays to God to forgive me knowing that we are all sinners and that we continue to sin even when we don't want to. Second, the sins are forgiven. They are committed to oblivion, and no memory of them shall be used when I am judged. I will be judged for my unrepeneted sins. So, whether I committed them or not is not the issue, of course I committed them, but what counts is that they are erased, as I am brought back into communion with God.
But this is what you are saying when you say that the failure to repent "sealed" the Fall.
Absolutely.
The Fall was over and complete when Adam blew it, whether he repented right after or not.
No, we can repent at the last breath and be saved.
There MUST be sin before repentance even enters the picture.
Absolutely. There was sin. They ate the forbidden fruit. They were given a chance to repent; they refused.
Don't we all agree that at SOME later point Adam DID repent?
Not sure, but failure to repent by Adam and Eve is like losing virginity. One can forgive it but you will never be a virgin again, unless you are born again as one. For that to happen, Christ had to come first.
We know for sure that God, by instruction, BANNED them from the knowledge of good and evil. So, what chance did she have against real evil?
Obedience to God...she was created perfectly capable of it.
It also doesn't work because God did not coach (lead) Eve into blowing it. He did allow the traffic, but He didn't send her into it.
No, but he put her right smack in the middle of it. No fence, no mote, nothing but reach out and touch...the next thing would have been handing the fruit to her. It doesn't get much closer than that.