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To: jo kus
You still have not given me a verse that says that the individual believer is guided by the Spirit to interpret the Scriptures with uncanny accuracy!

I have given you several Spirit/sanctification verses and argued that interpretation is part of sanctification. However, it may have been on a different line, and after your post here. If you have not seen it by now, just let me know and I'll try to find it.

Remember, God has given His Church apostles, preachers, evangelists and so forth. Everyone is NOT an apostles, preacher, evangelist, and so forth. Is it surprising that God would leave an authoritative body to interpret His Word?

Yes, it is surprising as practiced because it separates the laity from a personal relationship with God, and there is no accountability. It establishes "kings" which God said He didn't want in the OT.

15,584 posted on 06/06/2007 5:36:43 PM PDT by Forest Keeper (It is a joy to me to know that God had my number, before He created numbers.)
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To: Forest Keeper
I have given you several Spirit/sanctification verses and argued that interpretation is part of sanctification. However, it may have been on a different line, and after your post here. If you have not seen it by now, just let me know and I'll try to find it.

I saw them, and that is not what I asked for. I asked for verses that tell us that the individual believer is uncannily guided by the Holy Spirit to interpret Scriptures with "infallible" accuracy. I have already told you that the Bible tells us that the Apostles, the leaders of the Church OR the entire Church have been given that charism, not the individual. It should be painfully clear that the Spirit does NOT lead men to individually interpret Scriptures correctly. You are again making the mistake of equating holiness with Scripture reading. The later does not necessarily lead to the former.

Yes, it is surprising as practiced because it separates the laity from a personal relationship with God, and there is no accountability.

Your "relationship" with God is through an invisible idea, while mine is through the medium of people and things that I can see. I personally prefer the Catholic way. Yours is too subjective and emotionally driven for me.

It establishes "kings" which God said He didn't want in the OT.

Perhaps you have forgotten the numerous times that authority was established by the NT Scriputes, to include Jesus Christ HIMSELF! Isn't it clear that leaders were established in each community as related in the Scriptures? What was there purpose if people were expected to read and heed on their own?

It is pretty obvious that leaders were established in the latter writings to preserve what was once taught. The Bible is pretty clear that there were false teachers, no doubt using the Scriptural letters of Paul and so forth, to push forward their agenda or theological beliefs. The leadership was established by Christ Himself to preserve what He taught. The Bible is not enough to do this by itself, as is painfully clear in the mere existence of numerous Protestant denominations who claim the Bible as their sole authority... not seeing that THEY are their sole authority.

In the end, the discussion of Protestant vs Catholic comes down to "who is the final authority"? Myself or the Church? The Bible is not the final authority because it is a book subject to interpretation. God no doubt knows this and certainly doesn't place man as the final authority. Thus, we see Christ forming a leadership that WOULD be guided. This is all Scriptural. Individual bible reading is NOT.

Regards

15,595 posted on 06/07/2007 4:52:01 AM PDT by jo kus (Humility is present when one debases oneself without being obliged to do so- St.Chrysostom; Phil 2:8)
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