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To: kosta50; Kolokotronis; Agrarian; Forest Keeper; wmfights; xzins; wagglebee; bornacatholic
from the Orthodox point of view, the conceptual baptism hypothesized by the Latins in the case of our Most Holy Theotokos does not remove any "original sin."

I understand that. My point is that from the Catholic perspective, unless I misunderstand this difficult subject, there is no superhumanity because baptism removes the original sin.

We understand original sin as a macula, which of course, entails also concupiscense (disordered mind and weak will) and death. We do not, howwever, consider original sin as personal sin as it does not condemn to hell. We take the baptism clause in the Creed literally even when applied to children who are definitionally free from personal sin. These things may be ndeed difficult to bridge, but it is not fair to our understanding to say that Mary in our perspective is taking on superhuman qualities because of her immaculate conception. It is a bit like Protestants seeing someone kneeling in front of a statue of a saint and deciding "that man is an idolater". It ignores the native Catholic perspective and injects an innatural to us perspective in order to make the accusation.

1,114 posted on 12/11/2006 7:29:20 PM PST by annalex
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To: annalex; Kolokotronis; kosta50; jo kus

"My point is that from the Catholic perspective, unless I misunderstand this difficult subject, there is no superhumanity because baptism removes the original sin."

Except that the doctrine of the I.C. also states that she was filled with every grace -- to such supercapacity that she was, from that moment, able to give away her extra grace to others.

I don't know about you, but I didn't get that at my baptism.


1,158 posted on 12/12/2006 7:50:47 AM PST by Agrarian
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