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To: Forest Keeper
Paul was writing to the Corinthians who, as a group, Paul knew to be less than model Christians. He knew full well that there were pretenders among them. Unlike Catholicism, claiming to be a believer does not make one a believer. Paul knew that and was warning those pretenders to examine themselves and not take the Supper.

Paul is only writing to those who CAN receive the Eucharist. Thus, 1 Cor 11:28-30 CANNOT apply to those who are NOT Christians by Baptism. Paul is telling those who are to receive should examine themselves if they are worthy. In other words, no mortal sin. As to "true-believers", that is a highly subjective term that means nothing to me, because NO ONE knows whether they are a "true-believer". Only the elect are, and we don't know who the elect are, since we haven't had a full life history read to us yet.

I suppose you have fleshed me out. I must admit that I agree with those who agree with me. However, I fail to see the profundity in this.

Profundity? LOL! The point is whether YOU determine what God has revealed or not...Apparently, because you yourself have proclaimed to the world that you are a "true-believer", while "most Catholics" are not, then I suppose God speaks directly through you in all cases...

Reformers say that God reveals Himself to all believers.

AH! So according to your earlier statement, only "true-believers" will receive this knowledge. What is quite funny is that you all claim to be "true-believers", thus, justifying any particular theology that you desire to be as FROM GOD! Thus, the Jehovah Witnesses make the exact same claim you do - and disagree on whether Jesus is God or not. As it turns out, your religion is quite self-serving.

Sorry, I don't believer your self-serving claim. That would require me to believe that God cannot make up His mind on Who He is and what He has revealed, since there are so many "true-believers" out there who make diametrically opposed claims. God is truth. Thus, your claims are not believable. God must reveal Himself differently than you think.

The "mind of the Church" is simply a winner-take-all vote among those men you have decided to follow. I also follow the ideas of certain men. The difference is that mine must pass the test of scripture, whereas yours can say absolutely anything and you are required to follow no matter what.

I will respectfully disagree with you, as it appears you do not know the process of how dogma becomes part of the life of the Church.

Regards

10,992 posted on 02/22/2007 7:10:59 AM PST by jo kus (Humility is present when one debases oneself without being obliged to do so- St.Chrysostom; Phil 2:8)
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To: jo kus
Paul is only writing to those who CAN receive the Eucharist. Thus, 1 Cor 11:28-30 CANNOT apply to those who are NOT Christians by Baptism. Paul is telling those who are to receive should examine themselves if they are worthy. In other words, no mortal sin.

While your assumptions are imaginative, I'm afraid I cannot join in them. :) Besides, all it takes for one to be "able" to receive the Eucharist is for one to raise his hand and claim to be qualified. Within that group are certainly pretenders, so it works out the same. I never mentioned baptism, but since you do it in infancy, it is no indicator of whether someone winds up being a pretender or not.

Apparently, because you yourself have proclaimed to the world that you are a "true-believer", while "most Catholics" are not, then I suppose God speaks directly through you in all cases...

I'm not sure who you are confusing me with, but you don't seem to remember our prior conversations. I have NEVER, NOT ONCE, made any comments about how many Catholics I think are true believers. I haven't the slightest idea. Neither do I know how many Protestants are saved, or how many Southern Baptists are saved. On the latter, the best I can say is "at least one". :) Neither I, nor Luther, nor Calvin have any monopoly on the truth. Compare that to what you say about your hierarchy. The Holy Spirit leads all believers.

What is quite funny is that you all claim to be "true-believers", thus, justifying any particular theology that you desire to be as FROM GOD! Thus, the Jehovah Witnesses make the exact same claim you do - and disagree on whether Jesus is God or not. As it turns out, your religion is quite self-serving.

You are making another false accusation. Reformers do not say or think that everything out of our mouths is infallible and "from God". We just claim to follow scriptures, we don't claim to be perfect. This is in contrast to your hierarchy as a group. ...... I could not possibly care less what the JWs say. They have nothing to do with me. ...... Actually, one of the most self-serving faiths I have ever heard of is Catholicism. It's interesting you would accuse us of it. The infallibility of your Magisterium and Papacy is all based SOLELY on the say so of the men who claim to hold that power. You don't think THAT'S self-serving? LOL!

11,048 posted on 02/23/2007 2:33:55 PM PST by Forest Keeper
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