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Good exposé. The church is not the church when it hates God's people.
1 posted on 11/16/2006 9:39:47 AM PST by Blogger
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To: Blogger
Most Jews consider attempts to convert Jews to Christianity as effectively being anti-Semitic.

If so, then the term "anti-semitism" has utterly lost any significance ... it's just an insult-phrase, meaning "people I don't like".

2 posted on 11/16/2006 10:03:41 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilisation is aborting, buggering, and contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: Blogger

Do you believe it is hateful to evangelize Jews? That is the gist of point #11.


3 posted on 11/16/2006 10:06:36 AM PST by jboot (Faith is not a work)
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To: Blogger
The church is not the church when it hates God's people.

But are God's people really God's people, when they hate the church?

I tell the truth in Christ, I am not lying, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Spirit,
that I have great sorrow and continual grief in my heart.
For I could wish that I myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my countrymen according to the flesh,
who are Israelites, to whom pertain the adoption, the glory, the covenants, the giving of the law, the service of God, and the promises;
of whom are the fathers and from whom, according to the flesh, Christ came, who is over all, the eternally blessed God. Amen.

But it is not that the word of God has taken no effect. For they are not all Israel who are of Israel,
nor are they all children because they are the seed of Abraham; but, “In Isaac your seed shall be called.”
That is, those who are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God; but the children of the promise are counted as the seed.

- Romans 9:1-8


4 posted on 11/16/2006 10:07:32 AM PST by Alex Murphy
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To: Blogger
But that Jesus was a Pharisee by his being recognized and addressed as rabbi. And one would think (from reading the Gospels) that the Romans were not ruthlessly occupying the land, and had only a transitory role in Jesus' execution.

Hyam Maccoby, Revolution In Judaea: Jesus and The Jewish Resistance

Pope Benedict XVI (then Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger), Many Religions-One Covenant: Israel, the Church and the World

11 posted on 11/16/2006 10:19:31 AM PST by onedoug
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To: Blogger
Most Jews consider attempts to convert Jews to Christianity as effectively being anti-Semitic.

And understandingly so...But it does not however relieve us from the responsibility to witness to Jews, or anyone else...

Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Zion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Rom 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
Rom 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.

Sad but true, millions of church-goers haven't solved this mystery yet, even tho the answer is right there...

15 posted on 11/16/2006 10:52:25 AM PST by Iscool
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To: Blogger
Poor attempt at trashing the Catholic Church. Even the few Church Fathers cited (and not all of the citations are antisemitic) does not mean the Catholic Church was antisemitic.

However, I am sure there are examples of antisemitism from your own comuntiy of believers.

Please feel free to quote from your own comunity rather than finger-pointing at Catholics and everybody else leaving the impression y'all have been free from the sin of antisemitism

16 posted on 11/16/2006 10:58:09 AM PST by bornacatholic
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To: Blogger

Theres nothing in the article that proves that the early church fathers were "anti-semitic". Just hyper-sensitive, PC overeaction by the author.


21 posted on 11/16/2006 1:24:00 PM PST by Augustinian monk
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To: Blogger
Eusebius of Caesarea, in 325, blames the calamities which befell the Jewish nation on the Jews’ role in the death of Jesus: “that from that time seditions and wars and mischievous plots followed each other in quick succession, and never ceased in the city and in all Judea until finally the siege of Vespasian overwhelmed them. Thus the divine vengeance overtook the Jews for the crimes which they dared to commit against Christ. “ (Eusebius of Caesarea, Church History: Book II, Chapter 6: The Misfortunes which overwhelmed the Jews after their Presumption against Christ) [1]

*Josephus blamed the over zealous Jews for the destruction..Josephus, just another antisemite..

Saint Ambrose, Bishop of Milan (340-397 CE) - A bishop was accused of instigating the burning of a synagogue by an anti-Semitic mob, and Emperor Theodosius was preparing to order the bishop to rebuild it. Ambrose discouraged the Emperor from taking this step because it would appear to show special favoritism to the Jews.

*How is that proof of antisemitism?

Augustine of Hippo in Book 18, Chapter 46, of The City of God. wrote “The Jews who slew Jesus, and would not believe in Him, because it behoved Him to die and rise again, were yet more miserably wasted by the Romans, and utterly rooted out from their kingdom, where aliens had already ruled over them, and were dispersed through the lands (so that indeed there is no place where they are not), and are thus by their own Scriptures a testimony to us that we have not forged the prophecies about Christ.” [2] Augustine deems this scattering important because he believes that this is a fulfillment of certain prophecies, thus proving that Jesus was the Messiah. This is because Augustine believes that the Jews who were dispersed were the enemies of the Christian Church. He also quotes “that the Jews should be left alive and suffering as a perpetual reminder of their murder of Christ”.

*Here is the quote in context...

CHAP. 46.--OF THE BIRTH OF OUR SAVIOUR, WHEREBY THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH; AND OF THE DISPERSION OF THE JEWS AMONG ALL NATIONS, AS HAD BEEN PROPHESIED.

While Herod, therefore, reigned in Judea, and Caesar Augustus was emperor at Rome, the state of the republic being already changed, and the world being set at peace by him, Christ was born in Bethlehem of Judah, man manifest out of a human virgin, God hidden out of God the Father. For so had the prophet foretold: "Behold, a virgin shall conceive in the womb, and bring forth a Son, and they shall call His name Immanuel, which, being interpreted, is, God with us."(2) He did many miracles that He might commend God in Himself, some of which, even as many as seemed sufficient to proclaim Him, are contained in the evangelic Scripture. The first of these is, that He was so wonderfully born, and the last, that with His body raised up again from the dead He ascended into heaven. But the Jews who slew Him, and would not believe in Him, because it behoved Him to die and rise again, were yet more miserably wasted by the Romans, and utterly rooted out from their kingdom, where aliens had already ruled over them, and were dispersed through the lands (so that indeed there is no place where they are not), and are thus by their own Scriptures a testimony to us that we have not forged the prophecies about Christ. And very many of them, considering this, even before His passion, but chiefly after His resurrection, believed on Him, of whom it was predicted, "Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, the remnant shall be saved."(3) But the rest are blinded, of whom it was predicted, "Let their table be made before them a trap, and a retribution, and a stumbling-block. Let their eyes be darkened lest they see, and bow down their back alway."(4) Therefore, when they do not believe our Scriptures, their own, which they blindly read, are fulfilled in them, lest perchance any one should say that the Christians have forged these prophecies about Christ which are quoted under the name of the sibyl, or of others, if such there be, who do not belong to the Jewish people. For us, indeed, those suffice which are quoted from the books of our enemies, to whom we make our acknowledgment, on account of this testimony which, in spite of themselves, they contribute by their possession of these books, while they themselves are dispersed among all nations, wherever the Church of Christ is spread abroad. For a prophecy about this thing was sent before in the Psalms, which they also read, where it is written, "My God, His mercy shall prevent me. My God hath shown me concerning mine enemies, that Thou shalt not slay them, lest they should at last forget Thy law: disperse them in Thy might."(5) Therefore God has shown the Church in her enemies the Jews the grace of His compassion, since, as saith the apostle, "their offence is the salvation of the Gentiles."(6) And therefore He has not slain them, that is, He has not let the knowledge that they are Jews be lost in them, although they have been conquered by the Romans, lest they should forget the law of God, and their testimony should be of no avail in this matter of which we treat. But it was not enough that he should say, "Slay them not, lest they should at last forget Thy law," unless he had also added, "Disperse them;" because if they had only been in their own land with that testimony of the Scriptures, and not every where, certainly the Church which is everywhere could not have had them as witnesses among all nations to the prophecies which were sent before concerning Christ.

*That's another false charge I have exposed. Feel free to thank me at any time...

30 posted on 11/16/2006 2:36:45 PM PST by bornacatholic
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To: Blogger
Re Thomas Aquinas damning Jews to hell, what's your citation? Are you using anti-semitism and anti-Judaism, specifically anti-Talmudic-Judaism as synonyms?
31 posted on 11/16/2006 4:19:56 PM PST by Rampolla
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To: Blogger
The phrase anti-Semitism is a relatively recent word coined by a German, Wilhelm Marr in 1870. It refers to race and claims that Jews are hateful because of certain ineradicable biological characteristics. The word has now been re-defined to include anyone who does not like Jews. Christians should not be anti-Semitic but they may be anti-Jewish for theological and/or other reasons.

The phrase has expanded well beyond its original roots. For example the State Department's report on Global Anti-Semitism has defined it to mean: 1)Any assertion that Jews control gov't, media int'l business, and finances; 2)strong anti-Israel sentiment 3)virulent criticism of Israel's leaders 4)criticism of Jewish religion, leaders, literature 5)criticizing the US gov't for being under Zionist influence 6 )criticism of Zionism for promoting globalism 7) blaming Jewish leadership for inciting the Romans to crucify Jesus 8)diminishing the 6,000,000 figure re the Holocaust 9)calling Israel a racist state 10)claiming there is a Zionist conspiracy 11)claiming that Jews and their leaders created the Bolshevik revolution in Russia 12)making derogatory comments about Jewish persons.

Arabs are Semites. It would be well if you indicated the definition of anti-Semitism that you are using.
32 posted on 11/16/2006 4:39:28 PM PST by Rampolla
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To: Blogger
The church is not the church when it hates God's people.

The Church is God's people. It is the faithful remnant of racial Israel, and the ingrafted memebers of all other nations who have accepted the faith of Abraham as preached by the prophets and by Our Lord Jesus Christ. This is the message of the Gospel. See Jonah, Romans 11, Galatians 3, Acts 10, St. John 15, etc.

33 posted on 11/16/2006 8:00:41 PM PST by Andrew Byler
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To: Blogger

The author of this article apparently doesn't consider Muslim anti-Semitism to be a problem at all. Only Christians are anti-semitic. I also object to his categorizing Church Fathers and saints such as Thomas Aquinas as anti-Semites. But what do you expect from someone who uses the abbreviation "CE" instead of "AD"?


48 posted on 11/20/2006 12:31:34 PM PST by steadfastconservative
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To: Blogger
I guess this is why the Jews don't vote republican. Now I understand, sarcasm intended
55 posted on 11/20/2006 2:36:59 PM PST by cheme
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