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To: kerryusama04; 1000 silverlings; Diego1618; Dr. Eckleburg; HarleyD
Why is the Sabbath such a problem for you? The only reason to have a new Sabbath is if you wish to worship a new god.

This is really getting tiring. Everyone with any sense about them realizes that there has been a change of the law from the old covenant to the new covenant. Unless you insist on sacrificing animals and taking you medical conditions to a Levite and following all the old covenant ceremonial laws without any changes, then suggesting that those of use who see a change of the sabbath from the last day of the week to the first are "worshipping a new god" is just plain silly.

Certain portions of the law were a "shadow" of the finished work of Christ (Heb. 10:1). You do not need to worship in the shadows when the "Light of the World" has made His appearance.

The fact of the matter is that the seventh day under the old covenant was a sabbath day. But Jesus Christ, being the Lord the Sabbath, had the prerogative to change the day of the sabbath from the last day to the first day.

Those of us you are Christian sabbatarians believe He did precisely that, by the examples of His resurrection on the first day, His pouring out of the Holy Spirit on the first day, and the example of Paul and others in the church who worshipped on the first day. {For old covenant sabbatarians, the painful fact remains that nowhere in the NT do we find the Jewish/gentile church worshipping on the last day sabbath of the Jews.)

So let's at least be honest and admit this has nothing to do with worshipping other gods, unless you really do intend to circumcise your children and get a rabbi's OK to cut your hair.

428 posted on 09/29/2006 8:55:28 AM PDT by topcat54
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To: topcat54; 1000 silverlings; Diego1618; Dr. Eckleburg; HarleyD
This is really getting tiring. Everyone with any sense about them realizes that there has been a change of the law from the old covenant to the new covenant. Unless you insist on sacrificing animals and taking you medical conditions to a Levite and following all the old covenant ceremonial laws without any changes, then suggesting that those of use who see a change of the sabbath from the last day of the week to the first are "worshipping a new god" is just plain silly.

Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

The fact of the matter is that the seventh day under the old covenant was a sabbath day. But Jesus Christ, being the Lord the Sabbath, had the prerogative to change the day of the sabbath from the last day to the first day.

Well, yes, and no. Jesus, being the author of the Law, could very well have changed it. However, HE NEVER DID! In fact, as I have already shown you, had he or any of the apostles said any of the nonesense that you are, they would have been stoned as heretics using the standards I showed you in Deuteronomy. The Pharisees were trying to get Jesus to speak against the Law so they could kill Him. He didn't do it. Get over it.

The Bible does not say that Jesus was resurrected on the First Day of the week. The Bible says that the tomb was discovered early on the first day of the week.

The only Christians who can honestly worship on the first day are the Catholics who believe that their Church has the power to change times and law.

431 posted on 09/29/2006 9:45:13 AM PDT by kerryusama04 (Isa 8:20, Eze 22:26)
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To: topcat54; 1000 silverlings; HarleyD
Certain portions of the law were a "shadow" of the finished work of Christ (Heb. 10:1). You do not need to worship in the shadows when the "Light of the World" has made His appearance.

Amen. God is not capricious. The sabbath day was changed from the end of the week to the beginning of the week for a very good reason. A new heart; a new covenant; a new life; a new time.

439 posted on 09/29/2006 11:06:44 AM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: topcat54; Diego1618; kerryusama04; whipitgood; Buggman
The fact of the matter is that the seventh day under the old covenant was a sabbath day. But Jesus Christ, being the Lord the Sabbath, had the prerogative to change the day of the sabbath from the last day to the first day.

Those of us you are Christian sabbatarians believe He did precisely that, by the examples of His resurrection on the first day,

The case that he was resurrected on Saturday is much stronger biblically as Diego has pointed out numerous times.

His pouring out of the Holy Spirit on the first day,

The significance was that the outpouring of the spirit happened on Pentecost, one of God's Holy Days. This shows once again how important God's holy days are. They foretell and remind us of prophetic events in God's plan of salvation.

Most of these are suppositions to justify historical change. The fact is that Christians were keeping the true sabbath for quite a while after the death of Christ. In fact, it took an official edict from the Catholic church at the council of Laodecia in 360 AD to STOP Christians from observing the true sabbath:

CHRISTIANS must not judaize by resting on the Sabbath, but must work on that day, rather honouring the Lord's Day; and, if they can, resting then as Christians. But if any shall be found to be judaizers, let them be anathema from Christ. (Canon 29 [A.D. 360]

This is well over 300 years, 3 centuries AFTER the death of Christ.

Changing a commandment of God, one of the ten commandments, would be a huge controversy in the biblical church. Yet it is never, ever mentioned as an issue in the bible. Yet somehow it becomes an issue 3 centuries later?

{For old covenant sabbatarians, the painful fact remains that nowhere in the NT do we find the Jewish/gentile church worshipping on the last day sabbath of the Jews.)

Nonsense.

Act 13:42 And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.

Only gentiles are left. The gentiles want to be preached to, they want to go the church, the NEXT sabbath. They understood that the normative day of worship, the commanded day of worship by the God they wanted to worship, was the sabbath.

Act 13:43 Now when the congregation was broken up, many of the Jews and religious proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas: who, speaking to them, persuaded them to continue in the grace of God.
Act 13:44 And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.

The whole city came to church to hear the word of God...on the sabbath, as God commanded, a holy convocation:

Lev 23:2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts.
Lev 23:3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings

Those who want to learn about God, convene on the day he said to convene on, the sabbath day. In Acts 13, if the whole city didn't come to hear about God on the sabbath, they didn't hear about God.

444 posted on 09/29/2006 8:11:10 PM PDT by DouglasKC
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