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To: fortheDeclaration
It is clear that you know very little of Bible transmission. The Apocrypha books were never part of the Canonical OT, even Jerome would not make them part of the Vulgate. It took Trent to do that.

That isn't correct. Trent only reaffirmed the books that were in the Canon for centuries. What the Council addressed is that the new Protestant versions that were coming out were not official, acceptable translations.

Of course, the RCC killed anyone who they found with the correct translatons.

You've been reading too much Dan Brown or the spurious publication "Trail of Blood" that even honest Baptists will admit is a totally fabricated work of fiction.

So the Jesuits didn't kill William of Orange? They didn't attempt to kill King James? They don't believe that they can do anything to advance the cause of Rome? Now, who are you trying to kid? Next you will tell me the Inquisition never happened!

HUH??? William of Orange died of pneumonia after falling from his horse and breaking his collarbone!! I suppose you are going to tell me that the Jesuits were there and caused him to fall off his horse? Please.. where are you getting this information?

BBC info on William of Orange

As to King James..the Jesuits didn't attempt to kill him, it was a group led by Guy Fawkes that wanted to kill him because of the mistreatment of Catholics in England at the time. The co-conspirators were "Robert Catesby, John Wright, and Thomas Winter, the originators, Christopher Wright, Robert Winter, Robert Keyes, Guy Fawkes, a soldier who had been serving in Flanders, Thomas Percy, John Grant, Sir Everard Digby, Francis Tresham, Ambrose Rookwood, and Thomas Bates."

Not a Jesuit among them. Now I have to go to because I've got to meet a client by 10 in the morning. I've wasted enough time talking to someone that is dredging up past wounds and doing so with information that is completely false.

114 posted on 05/23/2006 12:16:49 AM PDT by FJ290
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To: FJ290; Dr. Eckleburg
It is clear that you know very little of Bible transmission. The Apocrypha books were never part of the Canonical OT, even Jerome would not make them part of the Vulgate. It took Trent to do that. That isn't correct. Trent only reaffirmed the books that were in the Canon for centuries. What the Council addressed is that the new Protestant versions that were coming out were not official, acceptable translations.

Jerome did not accept the Apocrypha books as equal to the Canon.

Other Catholic scholars held to the same view.

It was Trent that made the Apocrypha part of the Canon.

Before that they were considered secondary works.

Of course, the RCC killed anyone who they found with the correct translatons. You've been reading too much Dan Brown or the spurious publication "Trail of Blood" that even honest Baptists will admit is a totally fabricated work of fiction.

No, that is simple history.

How many Protestants did Bloody Mary burn at the stake?

Over 300 wasn't it or is that myth also?

So the Jesuits didn't kill William of Orange? They didn't attempt to kill King James? They don't believe that they can do anything to advance the cause of Rome? Now, who are you trying to kid? Next you will tell me the Inquisition never happened! HUH??? William of Orange died of pneumonia after falling from his horse and breaking his collarbone!! I suppose you are going to tell me that the Jesuits were there and caused him to fall off his horse? Please.. where are you getting this information?

BBC info on William of Orange

That is the wrong William of Orange.

William the Silent or William of Orange (William I, prince of Orange), 1533–84, Dutch statesman, principal founder of Dutch independence. 1 Early Life A descendant of the Ottonian line of Nassau, he was born at Dillenburg, near Wiesbaden, Germany, of Protestant parents. After inheriting (1544) the holdings of the branch of the Nassau family in the Low Countries and the principality of Orange in S France, William was reared a Roman Catholic at the insistence of Holy Roman Emperor Charles V, whose favorite page he became. In 1555 he was made stadtholder of Holland, Zeeland, and Utrecht. 2

Struggles with Spain William ably served Philip II of Spain as a diplomat, particularly in the making of the Treaty of Cateau-Cambrésis (1559), but Philip’s encroachments on the liberties of the Netherlands and the introduction of the Spanish Inquisition by Cardinal Granvelle led William to turn against the king. In 1563, with the help of counts Egmont and Hoorn, he succeeded in obtaining the removal of Granvelle, but under the regency of Margaret of Parma disorders grew in the Netherlands.

3 In 1566 the party of the Gueux was organized with William’s connivance, and when Alba was sent to the Netherlands to quell the rebels, William withdrew to Germany. When he refused Alba’s summons to appear before a tribunal, his property was confiscated. William and his brother Louis of Nassau raised an army to drive the Spanish out of the Netherlands. They at first met defeat, but in 1576 the provinces of the Netherlands, taking advantage of the mutiny of the Spanish army under John of Austria, united under William’s leadership in the Pacification of Ghent for the purpose of expelling the Spanish. In 1573, chiefly for the sake of policy, William had become a Calvinist.

4 The struggle with Spain continued. The Union of Utrecht (1579) proclaimed the virtual independence of the northern provinces, of which William was the uncrowned ruler, but the victories of the Spaniards under Alessandro Farnese forced William to seek French support by offering (1580) the rule over the Netherlands to Francis, duke of Alençon and Anjou. Philip II denounced William as a traitor, and a high price was set on his head in 1581.

5 William replied with his famous Apologia, in which he not only sought to vindicate his own conduct, but hurled violent accusations at the Spanish king. In the same year the representatives of Brabant, Flanders, Utrecht, Gelderland, Holland, and Zeeland solemnly declared Philip deposed from sovereignty over those provinces. William’s support of the unpopular Francis resulted in the wane of William’s own popularity during his last years. He was assassinated at Delft by a French Catholic fanatic, while the struggle against Spain was still in a critical stage. 6 http://www.bartleby.com/65/wm/WmSil.html

As to King James..the Jesuits didn't attempt to kill him, it was a group led by Guy Fawkes that wanted to kill him because of the mistreatment of Catholics in England at the time. The co-conspirators were "Robert Catesby, John Wright, and Thomas Winter, the originators, Christopher Wright, Robert Winter, Robert Keyes, Guy Fawkes, a soldier who had been serving in Flanders, Thomas Percy, John Grant, Sir Everard Digby, Francis Tresham, Ambrose Rookwood, and Thomas Bates." Not a Jesuit among them. Now I have to go to because I've got to meet a client by 10 in the morning. I've wasted enough time talking to someone that is dredging up past wounds and doing so with information that is completely false.

The Gunpowder Plot of 1605 was a desperate but failed attempt by a group of provincial English Catholics to kill King James I of England, his family, and most of the Protestant aristocracy in one attack by blowing up the Houses of Parliament during the State Opening. The conspirators had then planned to abduct the royal children, not present in Parliament, and incite a revolt in the Midlands.

The Gunpowder Plot was one of a series of unsuccessful assassination attempts against James I, and followed the Main Plot and Bye Plot of 1603. Many believe the Gunpowder Plot to have been part of the Counter-Reformation.(emphasis mine)

The aims of the conspirators are frequently compared to modern terrorists, however, their actions were not designed to merely influence government policy by evoking terror; their real aims were nothing short of a total revolution in the government of England and the installation of a Catholic monarch. (emphasis added) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gunpowder_Plot

The exercise was becoming costly and more hands were required, so Catesby drew more accomplices into the inner circle of the plot, including his servant Thomas Bates, John Wright's brother Christopher Wright, and Thomas Wintour's brother Robert Wintour. In the ensuing months, Parliament's sitting was continually delayed, allowing Fawkes to return to Flanders to get more powder to replace the powder which had begun to spoil, and Catesby to organise further support (and, some claim, to meet with Jesuit priests, including leaders of the order such as Father Henry Garnet and Father John Gerard. John Grant,(emphasis added) Sir Everard Digby, Robert Keyes, Ambrose Rookwood, and Catesby's cousin Francis Tresham were subsequently brought into the plot. Tresham was the son of Sir Thomas Tresham, one of the leading Catholics of the later Elizabethan period, and one who had suffered greatly for his faith at the hands of the government. Grant was the brother-in-law of Robert and Thomas Wintour, and Digby, Keyes and Rookwood were also disaffected members of Midland Catholic families. All but Fawkes and Bates were related either by blood or marriage.

http://www.britannia.com/history/gunpowder2.html

115 posted on 05/23/2006 12:47:51 AM PDT by fortheDeclaration (Am I therefore become your enemy because I tell you the truth? (Gal.4:16))
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