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To: Colofornian

>>Christ IS our Contemporary, Living Prophet and Living Revelation!
>>While He may choose to send forth mouthpieces on His behalf, they are
>>like undershepherds of the Chief Shepherd. We have no lack of a Living Prophet.
>>No mere mortal usurps His place on the Prophetic Throne. He is still Prophet,
>>High Priest and King as the prophets of old foretold!

So when is the last time you heard of anyone who spoke to god "face to face" as is recorded in the bible?

Two examples:
Gen 32:30 http://scriptures.lds.org/gen/32/30#30
Ex. 33:11 http://scriptures.lds.org/ex/33/11#11

I got more, but these two will suffice to make my point, god has always had the ability to talk to man "Face to Face.
Why (if he does not change) would he not do so now?
"Undershepards" Well, not exactly the way I would say it, but yes, Prophets work under and with Christ, having been appointed, and set apart by his authority. They are then to reveal his word as directed by him. Not all are worthy to receive revelation directly from God, and many would not survive the attempt. (I am one who does not feel worthy for the communication I do have, so I know what I am talking about here) So Jesus Christ uses righteous men to go where he would have no choice but to destroy (by his very presence) those he wants to communicate with.

This is a perfect system, as it helps both the messenger to grow in service and the message is delivered, as intended.

So lets ask this a different way, why (logically) would God stop using prophets?


67 posted on 04/28/2006 1:02:33 PM PDT by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: DelphiUser
So when is the last time you heard of anyone who spoke to god "face to face" as is recorded in the bible?

(1) Jesus said, "if you have seen me, you have seen the Father" (John 14:9). You don't need to go back to the OT for face-to-face encounters. Go also to the Book of Acts, where the resurrected Jesus appeared to Paul.

(2) Has Jesus appeared to others since then? I have no doubt He has. But you won't find it in a document like the D&C that reduces the "New Testament" into a "No Testament." The problem w/the D&C is that it's not noble. The Bereans were noble. They filtered the New Revelation by searching the old revelation to "see if what was said was true" (Acts 17:11). LDS turn that on its head, putting the old revelation through the grid of the new revelation. And they do that by adding the "veto phrase" - "insofar as correctly translated" -- and then using that as a trump card whenever it contradicts the newer revelation. Therefore, the Bible is relegated to secondary status.

(3) The problem w/the theology of a Resident King Prophet on earth that bumps Jesus out of the way is that the authority eminating from Commissioner Jesus is a more "on-the-go" thrust. In other words, since Jesus is now operating on a New Testament Covenant of a world-wide kingdom and is no longer strategically operating through a distinct people group like the Jews alone, "sent-ones" (apostles) are vital. LDS try to model an Old Testament focus where there is a stationary "House of the Lord" (temples) instead of realizing that people themselves are the temples of the Holy Spirit. [Note also the heavy "Zion" theme where the big base is Utah). LDS try to model an OT focus where there is a stationary "go-to" prophet instead of "on-the-go" apostles and disciples (Mt 28) who are led by the "Sent-One" Holy Spirit (John 16).

(4) LDS underplay the equivalency of the daily "face to face" interaction between the Holy Spirit and those He resides in. I'm sorry, but you can't get any more intimate than a Holy Spirit who is in no way confined to so-called living prophets, but resides in everyone who is in Christ!

(5) As for your alleged "face to face" prophets, how many revelations have been added to the D&C these past 110 years by your living prophets? Has it neared double-figures yet? If the LDS god is the equivalent of a living, active, dynamic volcano, why no evident lava flow equivalency of Scripture coming out of the depth? Why has the mountain been so silent? Name 3 to 4 vital revelations off the top of your head given by God through your living prophet?

78 posted on 04/28/2006 1:47:43 PM PDT by Colofornian
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To: DelphiUser
So lets ask this a different way, why (logically) would God stop using prophets?

Why do you assume this? Don't assume. The book of Acts makes it clear that the prophetic voice did not end w/OT prophets. Look, for example, at the book of Acts, where prophetesses are recorded in Acts 2:17 and 21:8-9. If the LDS is a true restoration of the original church...and you can't get any more original than the book of Acts, where are the prophetesses in the LDS Church?

The problem is you make the same mistake too many Christians make by assuming that the only ministers are those who are ordained. While ordained pastors are vital, ordination itself is not Scripturally prescribed. "Minister" just means "servant," of which all in Christ qualify. "Teaching-preaching elders" is a Biblical concept; but servanthood itself is not an ordained office.

My point is that LDS want to ordain an earthly living prophet as to the lone voice representing that role. And I'm afraid the only one with "all authority on heaven and earth" is Jesus Christ (Matt. 28:18-20). All authority is in Him; not in any mere mortal's voice.

He is your Authority. Your authority is not in a Utah office or in a priesthood. It's in the Living Prophet and High Priest, Jesus Christ.

If LDS were truly subscribing to Biblical precedents, there would be no "general authorities." Where in the Bible do you find that as an office?

We can't reduce everything to offices. That's been the problem of Christians who reduce ministry to an office and a clerical collar!

82 posted on 04/28/2006 1:57:33 PM PDT by Colofornian
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