You and I don't see eye to eye. It is apparent by our different interpretations of these scriptures. I doubt very much if you and I interpret the word "works" the same. I see Temple ordinances as a "work," as is church attendence, tithing, and helping the widowed and poor (which is a very noble work!)
However, James 2:18 says, "Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
Works is a manifestation of faith. It is not a requirement of salvation. Let me put it this way. A person is saved at the very instant when God puts genuine faith into his heart and he accepts Christ, even though you cannot yet see any outward evidence of faith. The change is first inside him. But his new faith is not complete until he acts upon it.
Suppose a FReeper pledges money during the quarterly pledge-a-thon. Perhaps he fully intends to send in money. But his promise is not made complete and perfect until he actually comes up with the cash. Likewise, faith is not made complete and perfect until it produces works. If it never produces works, it is dead.
James 2:23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
Here, James plainly agrees that faith is the only prerequisite for justification. Faith is indicated outwardly by obedience.
>>You and I don't see eye to eye. It is apparent by our different interpretations of these
>>scriptures. I doubt very much if you and I interpret the word "works" the same. I see
>>Temple ordinances as a "work," as is church attendence, tithing, and helping the
>>widowed and poor (which is a very noble work!)
>>However, James 2:18 says, "Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works:
>>shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
So, if you really have faith there will be works. So you think Mormons are all work and no faith? (This really doesn’t make sense so please tell me it isn’t so)
>>James 2:23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it
>>was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
You know don’t you that the verses were added later and the Books of the Bible as originally written were written in letter form? So you can’t chop one scripture off and say there, this proves my point, because the line must be taken in Context.
So if we add 21 and 22 in front of 23…
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
See, the Works came first, then the perfection.
Then James adds the point of his lecture
24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
>>Works is a manifestation of faith. It is not a requirement of salvation. Let me put it this
>>way. A person is saved at the very instant when God puts genuine faith into his heart
>>and he accepts Christ, even though you cannot yet see any outward evidence of faith.
>>The change is first inside him. But his new faith is not complete until he acts upon it.
This is not born out by scripture.
Do you believe men are free to believe, or not believe? Are we free agents? If God has to “Put genuine faith into“ my “heart”, and I don’t have that faith, then who’s fault is it?
Do you believe in predestination?
>>Here, James plainly agrees that faith is the only prerequisite for justification. Faith is
>>indicated outwardly by obedience.
Re-read verse 24, what you are saying directly contradicts the lesson James is teaching.
This is a real good example of why you should not answer questions about our religion, you don’t understand how we get to our positions, ergo you do not understand our positions.
Then how would you explain the passages which state that one is "baptized into Christ" (Rom 6:30, Gal 3:27)
Can one be saved while not in Christ?
Suppose a FReeper pledges money during the quarterly pledge-a-thon...If [faith] never produces works, it is dead.
The pledging doesn't make the Freeper a supporter - the giving does. The belief doesn't make a seeker a disciple - the obedience does. In both cases, the first step is an interest in becoming - not a becoming.
Faith without works is dead, demonic, useless according to James. Faith without works is a straw-man that James tears to shreds.
James 2:23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
Here, James plainly agrees that faith is the only prerequisite for justification.
Let's quote a bit more of that passage to let James make his own point. He states that "faith only" is not the only prerequisite for justification.
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? 22 Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made perfect? 23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, "Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness." And he was called the friend of God. 24 You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.
But let's be sure and be on the same page regarding what James means by "faith only". He's talking about a claim that some have made that obedience is not necessary for salvation, only faith. That's a warped definition of faith. The faith God wants is an obedient faith. James wants his readers to know that you can talk about your faith all day long, but if you are not obeying Christ, you're only fooling yourself about your faith and your salvation.