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Locked on 04/28/2006 7:28:28 AM PDT by Religion Moderator, reason:
Toxic thread turned personal |
Posted on 04/25/2006 6:19:21 PM PDT by Full Court
"Why do Catholics always land in the crossfire? Can't you all fight among yourselves?"
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I was questioning why an evangelist would send someone who had responded to an altar call to a Roman Catholic church. IOW, if a priest had talked with a non believer and that person wanted to be a believer wouldn't you question that priest's actions if he sent that person to a Baptist church?
I am not questioning your church's doctrine, or your faith.
"By grace are you saved through faith, and that not of works, that no man may boast ... Neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through love. (Paul)
Faith without works is dead faith, and has no power to save anyone. (James)"
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What was everyone fighting about in the Reformation?
From my Baptist perspective works are a reflection of Faith, but buy you nothing. Your works will not justify you, they are like "dirty rags" to the LORD.
Well, there are ONLY two sides. The right side and the wrong side. He was/is wrong. I saw NO point to read past the first two reasons that Cloud gave for saying Billy Graham is being disobedient to God, because they are BOTH lies. When someone starts out by telling lies there is no reason to read the rest of what they said.
I won't sit back and let him tell lies about the greatest Evangelist on Earth! He's going home to be with the Lord before long, and I hate to see ANYONE smear him in the twilight years of his life. There is NO doubt in my mind that Jesus has a very special place for Billy Graham, for his Faithful service for his entire life! Oh how I wish that we could ALL be so Faithful!
UGH. "Hour of Decision."
Im a Protestant...Southern Baptist to be exact...
So I take it that no Southern Baptist church, anywhere, was ever converted into a mosque (or bar, or pool hall, or Starbucks, or anything else)?
So, if I could "document" that tenn2005 was seen in a whorehouse yesterday, but NRA2BFree knew that tenn2005 was the town fire marshall and was there to serve a citation, would he need to peruse my "documentation" any further?
In other words, once I know the slander is false, I don't need to read more about the slander.
"Faith without works is dead." Inconvenient, but there it is. It ain't gonna go away.
So, your "faith alone" better have SOME works unless you plan on "dead faith alone" getting you into Heaven.
Oh, and I'm not Roman Catholic.
You can search FR archives to find the transcript of what Billy Graham said on Larry King Live. I didn't want to believe it either. If I have time I'll search for it later.
Can I add that Franklin seems doctrinally more sound than his father. I hope time and the ecumenical thing won't spoil him.
Very true, but the difference makes all the difference. Faith that works is the sancification process, which is all of God. It is the EVIDENCE of justification, not the means -- and it's all of God. Thankfully, God gives us the means to test the genuineness of our faith. The evidence is the work of the Holy Spirit in a regenerated, already justified, heart. Number one evidence: conviction and hatred of sin.
Anything else is the belief that you can save yourself by being good.
A lot of them, especially in England, were fighting to see whether they could steal the property of the Church.
From my Baptist perspective works are a reflection of Faith, but buy you nothing. Your works will not justify you, they are like "dirty rags" to the LORD.
Re-read James chapter 2, then. The "dirty rags" verse refers to the works of apostate Jews on the eve of the Babylonian conquest, not to Christians who have put on Christ through baptism (Galatians) and become partakers of the divine nature (2 Peter).
The works of the justified man are more than just the evidence of justification, like Christ's works are more than just the evidence of his divinity.
The "the belief that you can save yourself by being good" is the heresy of Pelagianism.
If the evangelist in question (a) considers Catholics to be Christians and (b) doesn't want to take sides in an intra-Christian denominational dispute, that makes perfect sense.
A Catholic priest isn't really free not to take sides.
I haven't found the one I'm looking for yet.
I have no problem with the sort of commentary in your link, people taking issue with Graham statements. If you note the tone and intent is light-years away from this particular thread, which is a slanderous stew of poisonous lies.
First: be very careful of that "transcript" ~ it is the same so-called transcript passed around by all these anti-Graham websites, which are all actually quoting each other QUOTING this "transcript"; there is no indication whatsoever of a primary source, other than the repeated claim that it's from a Schuller interview. Very suspect. Find it in a legitimate source and we'll talk. Second: the Graham quotes, even if accurate, are very garbled, almost incoherent, and could be interpreted in any number of ways, some far more generous to the evangelist than these websites desire with their convenient text snips (and all the SAME text snips). Third: Schuller, whom I've also met, is in real life a complete Clymer, and anyone having a conversation with him will be on disgusting turf from the outset.
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