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****Scripture never says we are saved by faith alone. That teaching was not invented until 16 centuries after the time of Christ. ******

"In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye were sealed with the holy spirit of promise,
Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased posession, unto the praise of his glory....
...And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins....

For BY GRACE ARE YE SAVED, and that NOT OF YOURSELVES, it is THE GIFT OF GOD, NOT OF WORKS, LEST ANY MAN SHOULD BOAST.
For WE are HIS workmanship, created in Christ Jesus UNTO GOOD WORKS which God hath BEFORE ORDAINED, that we should walk in them."

The Person saved by GRACE WILL DO GOOD WORKS because GOD has FOR ORDAINED THEM after the person has been saved, not because we can be saved by them!

Isn't it interesting that one "works" verse in James (To the 12 tribes scattered abroad) automaticly cancels out all of Paul's grace verses (To the ONE body of believers Jew and gentile)!
There seems to be a natural tendency for a sinner to feel the need to EARN their salvation.
If it can be earned then CHRIST DIED IN VAIN!

Ruy Dias de Bivar,

Thank you for your post on # 178. The issue at hand is whether or not the Bible says we are Justified by faith alone. It does not. As a formulation, "Justification by faith alone," contradicts several Scriptures quite directly.

As I mentioned to ScubieNuc in #226, the formulation of justification by faith alone means many different things to many different people. As a Catholic, I can agree with some of those people, depending on what they mean by the phrase. While the formulation doubtless has much to recommend it, it does however, presents several difficulties from a Scriptural standpoint. It appears to be offering you a few challenges as well in that regard, as you've referred to the Epistle of James as an Epistle of straw, and spoken of it as "the elephant in the room."

We all read Scripture with a number of assumptions we inherit from our religious traditions and our personal history. In this case, I think that some of those traditions are perhaps causing things to be read into Scripture that simply are not there. From the standpoint of this conversation, we Catholics do not see justification as a one time occurrence, but rather as a process. (We don't separate Justification and Sanctification.) Because of this, the references to Abraham being Justified on more than one occasion are not problematic for us, and we don't have to ask, "In which of the Scriptural references to him being justified by God was he really justified?" We also don't see a contradiction between St. Paul and St. James, because neither teaches Justification by faith alone, and St. Paul is not excluding all works from Justification. Faith is the root and foundation of our relationship to God, and so it is quite crucial; however, Scripture does not say we are justified by faith alone. One other point that I would like to make is that the Catholic Church does not teach that we are saved by works, or that we earn our salvation, which is a common misconception.

I say these not to debate the points, but rather to note that we tend to approach the Scripture from different angles on some of these issues. Otherwise, I think it can become very easy for Protestants and Catholics to talk past each other, even when they may be in substantial agreement on a particular topic.

I appreciate your post, and am very interested in how you read the Scriptures. In particular, I am wondering if you would be kind enough to elaborate on point you made.

"The Person saved by GRACE WILL DO GOOD WORKS because GOD has FOR ORDAINED THEM after the person has been saved, not because we can be saved by them!"

I understand that both our works and faith are from God, who works within us both to will and to do the good. Your statement seems to imply that good works and self-sacrifice come automatically to the individual. Can you clarify how you think about that?

Kind Regards,

-iq