Posted on 01/10/2006 4:14:51 AM PST by Quester
Contradictions Between the Book of Mormon and the Bible
Copyright © 1999 Institute for Religious Research. All rights reserved.
There are many serious objections to the claim of Joseph Smith and the LDS church that the Book of Mormon is divinely inspired latter-day scripture supplemental to the Bible. However, none are more significant than the numerous contradictions between Book of Mormon teaching and the Bible. This list is illustrative only, not exhaustive.
1. The Book of Mormon teaches that little children are not capable of sin because they do not have a sinful nature (Moroni 8:8). In contrast, the Bible in Psalm 51:5 clearly teaches that we have sinful nature from birth: "Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me" (NIV). (This does not mean that those who die in infancy are lost.*)
2. The Book of Mormon teaches that the disobedience of Adam and Eve in eating the forbidden fruit was necessary so that they could have children and bring joy to mankind (2 Nephi 2:23-25). In contrast, the Bible specifically declares that Adam’s transgression was a sinful act of rebellion that unleashed the power of sin and death in the human heart and throughout God’s perfect world (Genesis 3:16-19; Romans 5:12; 8:20-21). There is no Biblical support for the view that Adam and Eve could only fulfill the command to "be fruitful and multiply" (Genesis 1:28) by disobeying God’s command regarding the forbidden fruit (Genesis 2:17). The Book of Mormon teaching that these divine commands are contradictory, and that God expected Adam and Eve to figure out that in reality He wanted them to break the latter command ("of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it") in order to keep the former ("be fruitful and multiply"), has no basis in logic or the Biblical text, and attributes equivocation to God.
3. The Book of Mormon teaches that black skin is a sign of God’s curse, so that white-skinned people are considered morally and spiritually superior to black skinned people (2 Nephi 5:21). In contrast, the Bible teaches that God "made of one blood all nations of men" (Acts 17:26, KJV), that in Christ distinctions of ethnicity, gender and social class are erased (Galatians 3:28), and that God condemns favoritism (James 2:1).
4. The Book of Mormon teaches that, "it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do" (2 Nephi 25:23; see also Moroni 10:32). In contrast, the Bible teaches that apart from Christ we are dead in sin (Ephesians 2:1,5) and unable to do anything to merit forgiveness and eternal life. Salvation is wholly of grace (Ephesians 2:8-9; Romans 11:6; Titus 3:5-6), not by grace plus works. Good works are a result, not the basis, of a right relationship with God (Ephesians 2:10).
5. According to the Book of Mormon, about 600 years before Christ, a Nephite prophet predicted that "many plain and precious parts" (1 Nephi 13:26-28) would be removed from the Bible. In contrast, from the Bible it is clear that during His earthly ministry, Jesus himself constantly quoted from the Old Testament Scriptures, and showed full confidence in their completeness and accurate transmission as they had survived down to His time. Jesus declared that "heaven and earth shall pass away, but my word shall not pass away" (Mark 13:31; see also Matthew 5:18), and promised His disciples who were to pen the New Testament that the Holy Ghost "shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you" (John 14:26); Jesus further promised the apostles that they would "bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain" (John 15:16). These promises clearly imply that the fruit of the apostles — the New Testament Scriptures and the Christian church — would endure.
6. According to a Book of Mormon prophecy (Helaman 14:27), at the time of Christ’s crucifixion "darkness should cover the face of the whole earth for the space of three days." In contrast, the New Testament gospel accounts declare repeatedly that there was darkness for only three hours while Jesus was on the cross (Matthew 27:45; Mark 15:33; Luke 23:44).
An earlier prophecy in 1 Nephi 19:10 implies the three days of darkness will be more than regional in scope for it says this sign will be "unto those who inhabit the isles of the sea, more especially given unto those who are of the house of Israel." The darkness then would extend over the ocean to the islands and reach as far as Israel in the Middle East.
Book of Mormon references to the fulfillment of this prophecy, however, use wording that could be understood to mean the three days of darkness was only in the Americas, stating that the three days of darkness would be "over the face of the land." (3 Nephi 8:3ff; 10:9). This appears to be the position of the late Mormon General Authority B.H. Roberts in his book Studies of the Book of Mormon, p. 292). If this is the case, then this would resolve the apparent contradiction between the Bible and the Book of Mormon regarding what happened at the time of Christ's death, for we would have 3 hours of darkness in Israel and 3 days of darkness on the American continents. However, this would make the earlier prophecies of 1 Nephi and Helaman internally contradictory with later BOM references, since their phrasing of "the isles of the sea ... those who are of the house of Israel" and "the whole face of the whole earth" is difficult to understand as merely a localized time of darkness.
7. The Book of Mormon people are said to have observed "all things according to the law of Moses (2 Nephi 5:10; 25:24). However, although they are supposed to have been Hebrews, they were descendents of the tribe of Joseph (1 Nephi 5:17) or Manasseh (Alma 10:3), not the tribe of Levi and family line of Aaron, as the Law of Moses dictates (Numbers 3:10; Exodus 29:9; Numbers 18:1-7), so they would not have had a legitimate priesthood.
8. According to the Book of Mormon, there were many high priests serving at the same time (Mosiah 11:11; Alma 13:9-10; 46:6,38; Helaman 3:25) in the New World, among those it describes as Jewish immigrants from ancient Israel who "kept the law of Moses" (e.g., 2 Nephi 25:10; Jacob 4:5; Jarom 1:5). In contrast, it is clear from the Bible that only one individual at a time occupied the office of high priest under the Old Testament dispensation (see, for example Leviticus 21:10; Matthew 26:3; Hebrews 8:6-7). (The mention in Luke 3:2 of "Annas and Caiaphas being the high priests" is not a real exception -- in Christ’s time Israel was under the domination of the Romans, who intervened to change the high priest at will. That is, this office became a kind of "political football," rather than following the appointment process dictated in the Law of Moses. See John 18:13, which describes Annas as "father-in-law to Caiaphas, which was the high priest that same year.")
9. The people described in the Book of Mormon operated multiple temples (Alma 16:13; 23:2; 26:29). This violates the dictates of the Old Testament Scriptures on two counts: First, God commanded Israel to build only one temple to reflect that fact that there is only one true God (Deuteronomy 12:5,13-14; 16:5-6). Second, the one legitimate temple was to be built in Jerusalem (Zion), the location designated by God (The Old Testament is filled with explicit references to God choosing Jerusalem [Zion] as the place where "His name would dwell" in the temple: for example, 1 Kings 8:44,48; 11:13,32,36; 14:21; 2 Kings 21:7; 23:27; 1 Chronicles 28:4; 2 Chronicles 6:6; 7:12,16; Psalm 78:68-69; Isaiah 18:7.
10. The most common biblical terms used to describe the Old Testament priesthood, temple and appointed feasts, are entirely missing from the Book of Mormon. Here are 10 examples of such biblical terms with their frequencies, that never appear once in the Book of Mormon:
"laver" (13 times in Bible)
"incense" (121 times in Bible)
"ark of the covenant" (48 times in Bible)
"sons of Aaron" (97 times in Bible)
"mercy seat" (23 in Bible)
"day of atonement" (21 times in Bible)
"feast of tabernacles" (17 times in Bible)
"passover" (59 times in Bible)
"house of the LORD" (627 in Bible)
"Aaron" – this name appears 48 times in the Book of Mormon, but never in reference to the biblical Aaron or the Aaronic priesthood
Conclusion: The contradictions between the Book of Mormon and the Bible constitute a most serious obstacle to accepting the Book of Mormon as Latter-day scripture that is supplemental to the Bible. The Bible came first, not the Book of Mormon. And whereas the Bible is organically linked to the earthly ministry of Jesus Christ by extensive surviving manuscript evidence going back as far as A.D. 125-30, the Book of Mormon is wholly lacking in any such evidences of ancient origin.
Is it not reasonable, therefore, to make the Bible the standard for judging the Book of Mormon, and not the other way around? If we accept the Bible as our "measuring stick" for spiritual truth, the Book of Mormon must be rejected.
— Luke P. Wilson
John 17
21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.
25 O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me.
26 And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.
Why are you presenting these scriptures?
Psalm eighty two doesn't mean that we are Gods -- it means, as Paul also said -- that we will judge angels, etc. Psalm eighty two is dealing with corrupt judges, anyway. The whole verse is "ye are like gods but ye shall die like men..."
Point of my last was that those books of Mormon contradicted one another and failed the Biblical test in first John.
some of those things took place in AD and BC so they don't contradict!
What I wrote is clear if you choose not to acknowledge it that is ok!
You have your freewill!
Psalm eighty two doesn't mean that we are Gods -- it means, as Paul also said -- that we will judge angels, etc.
Psalm eighty two is dealing with corrupt judges, anyway. The whole verse is "ye are like gods but ye shall die like men..."
It looks to me you are taking liberty to make it say what you think!
Thus saith the Lord: Ye are gods and children of the Most High.
A Psalm of Asaph.
1 GOD standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.
2 How long will ye judge unjustly, and accept the persons of the wicked? Selah.
3 Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy.
4 Deliver the poor and needy: rid them out of the hand of the wicked.
5
.They know not,
.neither will they understand;
.they walk on in darkness:
.all the foundations of the earth are out of course.
6
.I have said,
.Ye are gods;
.and all of you are children of the most High.
7
.But ye shall die like men,
.and fall like one of the princes.
8 Arise, O God, judge the earth: for thou shalt inherit all nations.
It is cool that you are dropping Biblical scriptures all over the place;
but the inherent illogic of the Book of Mormon on a prescient point in First John regarding how we are to test spirits remains unanswered.
Also, laughable, (sorry!) is Joseph Smith's version of how to test the spirits:
by the feel of their handshake?
If you are going to discuss anything, discuss these points and how at odds they are with the Bible.
You seem to miss the point CJ the Book of Mormon and the Bible fit nicely togather,
It just does not agree with mainstream adaptation of the Bible!
Romans 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
Yes ... those which yield themselves to God are made to be His adopted children.
We are adopted into the family of God.
God is our Father ... and Christ is our elder brother.
But God does not confer onto us (His children) ... His Deity (i.e. Godhood).
This He reserves for Himself.
So that ... though we will be blessed beyond all imagining ... there is, has been, and will only ever be ... one omniscient, omnipresent, omnipotent God.
For thus saith the Lord, speaking through Isaiah the prophet ...Isaiah 44:6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.
...
Isaiah 44:8 Fear ye not, neither be afraid: have not I told thee from that time, and have declared it? ye are even my witnesses. Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any.
You seem to miss the point CJ the Book of Mormon and the Bible fit nicely togather,
It just does not agree with mainstream adaptation of the Bible!
Restornu, the Book of Mormon was made to fit wery well with the Bible.
There are sections of the Book of Mormon which are a word-for-word copy of what is in the Bible (in the very same Old English of the KJV translation).
The objection that historic Christianity has to the Book of Mormon ... is that it has not been proven to be completely true.
For instance, the Book of Mormon clearly indicates that the American Indians ... were the descendents of Lamanite Jews.
Modern science has proven that this is not the case.
There is absolutely no evidence of any kind that what the Book of Mormon says about the heritage of the American Indian is true.
The Book of Mormon says many good things, as it is patterned after the Bible ... but it's untruth makes it unreliable as a basis for one's belief.
Restornu, ... I would advise that there is everything that you need (in the way of scripture) ... in the Bible.
Make it (the Bible) your sole source of scripture.
Christians have been doing so for almost 2000 years ... and their souls have been blessed because of it.
Quester you completely ignored what I had posted and merrily started on your Johnny one note champaing!
What I have written is what Jesus had testified of him and the Father are ONE and Jesus said those of us who
Article of Faith 4
.We believe that the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel are:
.first, Faith in the Lord Jesus Christ;
.second, Repentance; third,
.Baptism by immersion for the remission of sins;
.fourth, Laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost
We are too Keep The Lord Commandment...
Matt. 5:
48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
Eph.4
Tell you all the things that are to take place and being done and most of all
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all ONE in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ’s, then are ye Abraham’s seed,and HEIRS according to the PROMISE.
Roman 8
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we ARE the CHILDREN of God:
17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also GLORIFIED TOGATHER together.
WHEN YOU ARE GLORIFIED YOU BECOME JOIN HEIRS AND ARE part of the family of gods!
Heavenly Father will always be greater than Jesus and Jesus will always be greater than those being who was Resurrected and received Celestial Glory, and Eternal life!
GUIDE TO THE SCRIPTURES
MAN, MEN
See also God, Godhead; Sons and Daughters of God; Spirit; Spirit Creation
Refers to all mankind, both male and female. All men and women are the literal, spiritual offspring of a Heavenly Father. When they are born into mortality, they receive physical, mortal bodies. These bodies were created in God’s image (Gen. 1: 26-27). Men and women who are faithful in receiving the necessary ordinances, keeping their covenants, and obeying God’s commands will enter into their exaltation and become as God.
God created man in his own image, Gen. 1: 27 (Mosiah 7: 27; D&C 20: 17-18). What is man, that thou art mindful of him? Ps. 8: 4-5. Cursed is the man that trusteth in man and maketh flesh his arm, Jer. 17: 5 (2 Ne. 4: 34; 28: 26, 31). When I became a man, I put away childish things, 1 Cor. 13: 11. Men are that they might have joy, 2 Ne. 2: 25. The natural man is an enemy to God, Mosiah 3: 19. What manner of men ought ye to be? 3 Ne. 27: 27. The works of man are frustrated, not the works of God, D&C 3: 3. You should not fear man more than God, D&C 3: 7 (D&C 30: 11; 122: 9). All things are made for the benefit and the use of man, D&C 59: 18. I know that man is nothing, Moses 1: 10. God’s work and glory is to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man, Moses 1: 39.
Man, a spirit child of Heavenly Father: They fell upon their faces, and said, O God, the God of the spirits of all flesh, Num. 16: 22 (Num. 27: 16). Ye are the children of the Lord your God, Deut. 14: 1. Ye are gods and all of you are children of the Most High, Ps. 82: 6. Ye are the sons of the living God, Hosea 1: 10. Have we not all one Father? Hath not one God created us? Mal. 2: 10. We are the offspring of God, Acts 17: 29. The Spirit itself beareth witness that we are the children of God, Rom. 8: 16. Be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, Heb. 12: 9. The spirits of all men are taken home to that God who gave them life, Alma 40: 11. The inhabitants of the worlds are begotten sons and daughters of God, D&C 76: 24. Man was in the beginning with the Father, D&C 93: 23, 29. God created all men spiritually, before they were upon the face of the earth, Moses 3: 5-7. I am God; I made the world, and men before they were in the flesh, Moses 6: 51.
Man, potential to become LIKE Heavenly Father: Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father, Matt. 5: 48 (3 Ne. 12: 48). Is it not written in your law that ye are gods? John 10: 34 (D&C 76: 58). We may become heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, Rom. 8: 17. Thou art a son, and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ, Gal. 4: 7. When he shall appear, we shall be like him, 1 Jn. 3: 2. To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me on my throne, Rev. 3: 21. To them have I given to become the sons of God, 3 Ne. 9: 17. Those who inherit the celestial kingdom are gods, even the sons of God, D&C 76: 50, 58. Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, D&C 132: 20.
Just because you don't like the message does not change scripture!
Just because your creed that was debated which concept of God to embrass does not change scripture!
Some can murmur all they want it still don't change scripture!
Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, D&C 132: 20.
Restornu, the Bible never says that the children of God (i.e. believers) will ever have ... all power.
Indeed ... how could that be ?
How could we all, each, ... have all power ?
If I have power and you have power, ... then neither of us has ... all power.
Biblically, only one will ever have all power ... and that is God.
Biblically, our reward for placing our faith in Jesus ... is eternal life with God, the Father.
We will live as one big happy family forever ... with our all-powerful Father.
That is God, the Father's goal ... that we all be together and love Him ... and one another.Revelation 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
If this topic gods is mention in a year during class, it is because that is the chapter we are covering and reference much of our lessons is to be reminded of wonderful things in our scriptures and also to put off the natural man-
2 Ne. 25:
26 And we talk of Christ, we rejoice in Christ, we preach of Christ, we prophesy of Christ, and we write according to our prophecies, that our children may know to what source they may look for a remission of their sins.
Mosiah 3:
19 For the natural man is an enemy to God, and has been from the fall of Adam, and will be, forever and ever, unless he yields to the enticings of the Holy Spirit, and putteth off the natural man and becometh a saint through the atonement of Christ the Lord, and becometh as a child, submissive, meek, humble, patient, full of love, willing to submit to all things which the Lord seeth fit to inflict upon him, even as a child doth submit to his father.
THIS IS ANOTHER OF MY FAVORIT!
2 Nephi 2
11 For it must needs be, that there is an opposition in all things. If not so, my first-born in the wilderness, righteousness could not be brought to pass, neither wickedness, neither holiness nor misery, neither good nor bad. Wherefore, all things must needs be a compound in one; wherefore, if it should be one body it must needs remain as dead, having no life neither death, nor corruption nor incorruption, happiness nor misery, neither sense nor insensibility.
12 Wherefore, it must needs have been created for a thing of naught; wherefore there would have been no purpose in the end of its creation. Wherefore, this thing must needs destroy the wisdom of God and his eternal purposes, and also the power, and the mercy, and the justice of God.
13 And if ye shall say there is no law, ye shall also say there is no sin. If ye shall say there is no sin, ye shall also say there is no righteousness. And if there be no righteousness there be no happiness. And if there be no righteousness nor happiness there be no punishment nor misery. And if these things are not there is no God. And if there is no God we are not, neither the earth; for there could have been no creation of things, neither to act nor to be acted upon; wherefore, all things must have vanished away.
14 And now, my sons, I speak unto you these things for your profit and learning; for there is a God, and he hath created all things, both the heavens and the earth, and all things that in them are, both things to act and things to be acted upon.
15 And to bring about his eternal purposes in the end of man, after he had created our first parents, and the beasts of the field and the fowls of the air, and in fine, all things which are created, it must needs be that there was an opposition; even the forbidden fruit in opposition to the tree of life; the one being sweet and the other bitter.
16 Wherefore, the Lord God gave unto man that he should act for himself. Wherefore, man could not act for himself save it
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This is another thing some of you MS who seemed hung up on,(work/deeds) keeping the Faith and LDS doing good works
We know that "Charity Never Faileth!", doing our Family History learning about all of the hardships our ancestors endur and that we are here because the family carried on, learning to follow the Lord to take on Jesus name and try his work to do! We humbly try to be the arms and legs of the Lord to help where we can!
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Sorry I digress back to your original concern!
Questor say; Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, D&C 132: 20.
Restornu, the Bible never says that the children of God (i.e. believers) will ever have ... all power.
Indeed ... how could that be ?
How could we all, each, ... have all power ?
If I have power and you have power, ... then neither of us has ... all power.
Biblically, only one will ever have all power ... and that is God.~ Quester
To began with where did you Quester get this quote from?
You sure do need a new source Quester!
Because if you are going to quote one of the LDS Doctrines and Covenants make sure for it is only right you give the whole verse, else wise it is out of contexts!
Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, D&C 132: 20.
THIS IS THE WHOLE VERSE! D & C
20 Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from everlasting to everlasting, because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, and the angels are subject unto them.
I also include the covenants to obtain the promise!
21 Verily, verily, I say unto you, except ye abide my law ye cannot attain to this glory.
22 For strait is the gate, and narrow the way that leadeth unto the exaltation and continuation of the lives, and few there be that find it, because ye receive me not in the world neither do ye know me.
23 But if ye receive me in the world, then shall ye know me, and shall receive your exaltation; that where I am ye shall be also.
24 This is eternal lives—to know the only wise and true God, and Jesus Christ, whom he hath sent. I am he. Receive ye, therefore, my law.
25 Broad is the gate, and wide the way that leadeth to the deaths; and many there are that go in thereat, because they receive me not, neither do they abide in my law.
26 Verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man marry a wife according to my word, and they are sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, according to mine appointment, and he or she shall commit any sin or transgression of the new and everlasting covenant whatever, and all manner of blasphemies, and if they commit no murder wherein they shed innocent blood, yet they shall come forth in the first resurrection, and enter into their exaltation; but they shall be destroyed in the flesh, and shall be delivered unto the buffetings of Satan unto the day of redemption, saith the Lord God.
27 The blasphemy against the Holy Ghost, which shall not be forgiven in the world nor out of the world, is in that ye commit murder wherein ye shed innocent blood, and assent unto my death, after ye have received my new and everlasting covenant, saith the Lord God; and he that abideth not this law can in nowise enter into my glory, but shall be damned, saith the Lord.
28 I am the Lord thy God, and will give unto thee the law of my Holy Priesthood, as was ordained by me and my Father before the world was.
29 Abraham received promises concerning his seed, and of the fruit of his loins—from whose loins ye are, namely, my servant Joseph—which were to continue so long as they were in the world; and as touching Abraham and his seed, out of the world they should continue; both in the world and out of the world should they continue as innumerable as the stars; or, if ye were to count the sand upon the seashore ye could not number them.
31 This promise is yours also, because ye are of Abraham, and the promise was made unto Abraham; and by this law is the continuation of the works of my Father, wherein he glorifieth himself.
32 Go ye, therefore, and do the works of Abraham; enter ye into my law and ye shall be saved.
33 But if ye enter not into my law ye cannot receive the promise of my Father, which he made unto Abraham.
34 God commanded Abraham, and Sarah gave Hagar to Abraham to wife. And why did she do it? Because this was the law; and from Hagar sprang many people. This, therefore, was fulfilling, among other things, the promises.
35 Was Abraham, therefore, under condemnation? Verily I say unto you, Nay; for I, the Lord, commanded it.
36 Abraham was commanded to offer his son Isaac; nevertheless, it was written: Thou shalt not kill. Abraham, however, did not refuse, and it was accounted unto him for righteousness.
37 Abraham received concubines, and they bore him children; and it was accounted unto him for righteousness, because they were given unto him, and he abode in my law; as Isaac also and Jacob did none other things than that which they were commanded; and because they did none other things than that which they were commanded, they have entered into their exaltation, according to the promises, and sit upon thrones, and are not angels but are gods.
Do you Quester, CJ,know what Abraham’s promise is?
Gal. 3: 29
29 And if ye be Christ’s, then are ye Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.
BD Abraham, Covenant of
Being an heir to the Abrahamic covenant does not make one a “chosen person” per se, but does signify that such are chosen to responsibly carry the gospel to all the peoples of the earth. Abraham’s seed have carried out the missionary activity in all the nations since Abraham’s day. (Matt. 3: 9; Abr. 2: 9-11).
BD Seed of Abraham
The heirs of the promises and covenants made to Abraham, and obtained only by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the gospel of Jesus Christ. Men and women become heirs by faithfulness to covenant obligations whether they are literally of Abraham’s lineage or by adoption. See Gal. 3: 26-29; Gal. 4: 1-7; D&C 84: 34; D&C 103: 17; D&C 132: 30; Abr. 2: 9-11. Literal seed may also lose their blessings by disobedience, as in Rom. 9: 6-8. Cf. JST Matt. 3: 36-37; JST Luke 3: 13-14.
The LDS can know these things because the Book of Mormon and D&C is able to complete the original contracts that the Lord had between his Children!
When I use to read the Bible before I was a convert I would read passages that seemed vital but would seem lacking or just fade away!
Now that I have the Standard Scriptures there are no gaps!
That part of the world still today is full of twist and turns just imagine what it was like back in those days!
The restoration of the Gospel was made on the Western Hemisphere!
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Quester you have claimed
Biblically, only one will ever have all power ... and that is God. ~ QUESTER
But if you read Queater and CJ Luke 6-
Luke 6:
40 The disciple is not ABOVE HIS MASTER: but every ONE that is PERFECT SHALL BE AS HIS MASTER.~ KJB
On some level I agree Quester, but you have left out protocol, and the change of command, and order in the Lord kingdom before privileges granted it is predicated upon one “Keeping the Covenant the promise is binding with the Lord!
If you humbly search the scriptures you will see it is written and that these things testifies it is the word of God!
1- Jesus said there will be none Greater than the Father!
2- After the Heavenly Father there will be none Greater than Jesus!
3- Man who receives Celestial Glory will be Greater than Angels etc!
But you know that the very first lie, the very first deception that Satan tempted Eve with was that if she ate the fruit, in disobedience of God's word, that "ye shall be as gods"?
Gen 2 9
.And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight,
.and good for food;
,the tree of life also in the midst of the garden,
.and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
Gen 2 17
.But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil,
.thou shalt not eat of it:
.for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.
Gen 3 1-5
1-
.NOW the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made.
.And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said,
.Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
2-
.And the woman said unto the serpent,
.We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
3-
.But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden,
.God hath said,
.Ye shall not eat of it,
.neither shall ye touch it,
.lest ye die.
Now in Gen 1 none of this extended words was listed yet Eve did recieve this instruction from God so what happen in Gen 1 that the words of are not there???
4
.And the serpent said unto the woman,
.Ye shall not surely die:
5
.For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof,
.then your eyes shall be opened,
.and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
1- Adam and Eve did know Good and Evil like the gods!
2- Their eyes were open(they were ashame of their nakedness)
3-Surely they would die(This was the lie, because they lost in the garden there innocents from only knowing good to also gained knowledge of evil and dorn a temporal body which will die)
****
And you could not come up with a reasoned response as to how and why the Book of Eter and Book of Ne.
(whatever that is) contradict one another and can't seem to figure out if Jesus came in the flesh or the spirit.
You can't get out of it by saying that one was in BC and the other AD.
What you can't ponder and think things through CJ, If you apply yourself and ponder and pray you will see this clearly!
In THE BOOK OF ETHER CHAPTER 3 - 17 “And now, as I, Moroni, said I could not make a full account of these things which are written, therefore it sufficeth me to say that Jesus showed himself unto this man in the spirit, even after the manner and in the likeness of the same body even as he showed himself unto the Nephites.”
This makes no sense. Either Jesus was Spirit or Flesh after the Resurrection.
AFTER THE RESURRECT JESUS WAS FLESH AND BONE!
It is a vitally important point, and it is contradictory even within the Book of Mormon because the passage in the Nephites that Moroni refers to reads that Jesus had the South American people put their hands on his wounds. It might be contradictory in your mind but it is not contradictory in the Book of Mormon!
Listen Up Friend!
Ether was written in 600 BC ~ BC means Before Christ! He was still in the Spirit!
After the Resurrection Jesus did visit those in South America around 34 AD AD means Anno Domini or In The Years of Our Lord!
John 10:
16 And other sheep I have, which are NOT of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.
Moroni was recapping the records for those timelines around 421 AD!
****
<>This is a vital Biblical testing of the spirits, as per 1 John, as I have said before.
1 Jn. 4:
1 BELOVED, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
You play this scripture because you assume Joseph Smith is a false Prophet!
I say you know nothing about other prophets in the Bible only what you read, so how do you really know??
Just because you have not encounter any enities from beyond the veil dose not mean it does not happen!
1 Jn. 4:
1 BELOVED, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
In order to try/test what John tell us in 1 JN 4 one must believe they still can receive revelation?
Most of you MS believe the Heavens are closed!
The LDS who are grounded in the Scriptures has excellent Spiritual discernment!
Not to nitpick, but this wasn't the first lie that Satan told. In fact, it wasn't even a lie. The first lie was that man would not die:
Gen 3:2 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
Gen 3:3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.
Gen 3:4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
We know that verse 4 is a lie because Adam and Eve (and everyone after them) most certainly die.
The next verse isn't really a lie and has nothing to do with the discussion you're having:
Gen 3:5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
God attests:
Gen 3:22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever:
Man did become as Gods, knowing good AND evil. Formerly man only knew good.
Hi Doug
I think I did address that in
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/1555210/posts?page=394#394
But thank you for your clarification!
Some MS think that is part of the lie, when it only switch their status from living forever to the temporal body so they could be tried and tested, to receive the resurrected Eternal Body of Flesh and Bone!
again nice to hear form you Doug!
Oops...so you did! I should have read down the thread further. Carry on and nice hearing from you too!
First of all it is you mainstreamers, that are fixated and spend all of your time on the subject the "g" word etc!
Well ... I understand that it was a favorite subject of Joseph Smith's.
Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, D&C 132: 20.
To began with where did you Quester get this quote from?
You sure do need a new source Quester!
Because if you are going to quote one of the LDS Doctrines and Covenants make sure for it is only right you give the whole verse, else wise it is out of contexts!
You cited this passage (minus context), Restornu ... at the end of the last large paragrah of your previous response.
Do you Quester, CJ,know what Abraham’s promise is?Genesis 22:17 That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which is upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies;
18 And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice.
Sorry, but scripture doesn't quite match your interpretation.
Gen 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.
Scripture lists three reasons why Eve was tempted:
1. She thought the fruit would taste good.
2. She saw that the fruit was pleasant to the eye.
3. She thought the fruit would make her wise.
Nowhere does scripture state that she wanted to be "like God" in any way other than knowing good or evil, or becoming wise. Scripture is completely silent on her motivations other than the ones listed.
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