[HarleyD]

You are creating a false dichotomy, HD

Perhaps. I'm simply a Protestant bumpkins who is trying to understand the relationship between Orthodox and Catholic, their focus on tradition, and what precisely infalibility means.

We may not agree on the "mechanism" of how the Eucharist becomes Real Presence, but we believe equally that it does.

I think it's more than just mechanism and I'm not talking about the Eucharist for which I think there is considerable agreement on between the Orthodox and Catholics. Rather I'm talking about those beliefs where there is considerable disagreement, like original sin, that has been established from the "chair of Peter". I would imagine the Orthodox must have some similar method of making doctrinal decisions. Both infalible, both based on tradition.

Anyway, our differences did not result in 33,000 different "churches," as is the case with Protestants

How do you know? If every local Orthodox church is free to formulate their own local doctrinal position, as has been stated, you could have far more than 33,000 different "Churches" each running around saying all sorts of things. Protestants believe the basic core beliefs as well. There isn't anything different. (We'll skip my argument for the moment that most of them follow an Arminian (free will) belief-not a true Reformed position.)

Anyone who started to teach that one should sin boldly could not confuse anyone in the Church to consider it as Tradition, since no Church Father, as Kolokotronis repeatedly shows, even those who walked with Apostles, never, ever espoused any interpretation similar to Luther's heresy.

Oh, that old chestnut. You totally misread Luther's statement. It's no different than Augustine's statement, "Love God, and do what you want." But then, you guys don't like Augustine either.

He [Luther] hated the Book of James and wanted it removed form the NT.

Luther held a low view of James, just like many of the Church such as Eusebius and Jerome. I would recommend the following article Luther’s View of the Canon of Scripture especially chapter 5: Luther’s Opinion Of The Book Of James.

[Kolokotronis]

"Rather I'm talking about those beliefs where there is considerable disagreement, like original sin, that has been established from the "chair of Peter"."

I could be wrong, but I don't think the Augustinian construct of "original sin" has been dogmatically defined by the Western Church. It goes without saying, however, that the dogma of the Immaculate Conception, or so the West would have it, is necessitated by that concept.

[kosta50]

I'm talking about those beliefs where there is considerable disagreement, like original sin, that has been established from the "chair of Peter"

The Orthodox Church does not deny the original (ancestral) sin — the sin of Adam and Eve. The Orthodox Church, and I believe the Roman Catholic Church, believes that we do not inherit their sin (i.e. guilt) but only propensity to sin — a defective nature that tends to sin as a result of ancestral sin.

I believe St. Augustine's choice of words the, "original sin," was an unfortunate mistake because it serves as the basis for the Reformed theology of total depravity which the Church never taught. Again, only the fallen angels are dead in sin; there is no salvation for them.

If every local Orthodox church is free to formulate their own local doctrinal position, as has been stated, you could have far more than 33,000 different "Churches" each running around saying all sorts of things

I am not sure where this comes from, perhaps something Kolokotronis wrote but I am sure he will be the first to correct himself by saying that this is not true. Church Fathers were free to hypothesize and propose qeologoumena [theologoumena], or "religious opinion," which in no way represent Church doctrine. If you want to know what the Church doctrine is read the Ecumenical Councils. If it was not proclaimed by a Council it is not the doctrine of the entire Church.

Individual Churches may have certain theological ideas, for example, the Russian toll-houses which are faintly reminiscent of the Purgatory, and not shared by other Orthodox Churches, but all Orthodox Churches believe that the soul of the departed is subjected to an "interim period" of waiting, knowing that it is destined either to hell or to bliss, without going into speculative details of this "place" where the souls are.

So, to say outright that the Purgatory is wrong is wrong, but we can question the details of the Latin teaching, as we question the teaching of "transubstantiation" yet we at no time doubt that it expresses the very same faith we hold — that the bread and wine do become the Body and Blood of Christ; as to how this happens, the Orthodox simply leave it to that favorite of yours, a "Mystery of God".

Luther held a low view of James, just like many of the Church such as Eusebius and Jerome

The devil is in the details, HD. Why did they hold such a low view of an Apostle (the book of James was not a disputed book to the best of my knowledge); what were their reasons. With Luther, it clashed directly with his entire theology of a "dead faith."

[jo kus]

You totally misread Luther's statement. It's no different than Augustine's statement, "Love God, and do what you want." But then, you guys don't like Augustine either.

Are you talking to me or Kolo? St. Augustine was quite Catholic if you bothered to read beyond "Nature and Grace" and things refering only to grace/free will and predestination.

Luther held a low view of James

That's an understatement. Didn't he call it a "epistle of straw" and "throw Jimmie in the river" or "burn him in the stove fire"? Funny way of refering to the Divine Word of God...

Regards

[Kolokotronis]

"If every local Orthodox church is free to formulate their own local doctrinal position, as has been stated, you could have far more than 33,000 different "Churches" each running around saying all sorts of things."

Harley, no local Orthodox Church, if you mean at the parish level, gets to decide dogma for itself. Only an Ecumenical Council can do that. Where did you get this idea? "Doctrine" is a somewhat different matter, but we really don't "decide" these issues. We look to the past to see what was dome before us and conform to that. Our local councils have made doctrinal proclamations but they usually (but not always) are more in the nature of disciplinary matters.

Try a read of this; it will explain alot:

http://www.frederica.com/writings/orthodox-controversies.html