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To: Forest Keeper; annalex; Kolokotronis; Agrarian; HarleyD; jo kus
I think Isa 45:7 says it clearly enough: "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things."

Is that a quote from your Bible, Kosta? I'll have to remember the Orthodox translation

The quote was from KJV. My OT Bible (LXX, Septuagint) says this:

"I am he that prepared light, and formed darkness; who make peace, and create evil; I am the Lord God, that does all these things." [Esaias 45:7]

The Greek word used is derived from Greek kakos, meaning "of bad nature" or "wicked." In the Hebrew version the word ra` is used meaning "bad" or "evil."

Speaking only for myself, and at my level of development, I do not equate bad things that happen NECESSARILY with evil. God caused the flood, which was a disaster (the word my Bible uses). Was this evil...? I would say 'No'. It was righteous by definition, BECAUSE God did it

I agree, without going into this. But, you bring up another interesting point: if the Bible is inerrant (i.e. if there are no errors due to translation or misconception or miscopying, etc.) how could two versions of the same Bible use two different words that mean similar but not identical concepts?

The Jewish idea of righteousness and even sin is not the same as ours (Christian), and their interpretation of the same books that we call the Old Testament are like night and day. They have no concept of salvation; they don't understand why it would be necessary!

Since we are no this subject, maybe you can explain how come 2 Kings 8:26 says Ahaziah was 22 years old and 2 Chron 22:2 says he was 42 when he became king? Or maybe you can explain how come 2 Sam 6:23 says Michal had no children and 2 Sam 21:8 says she had five!, or 1 King 4;26 says Solomon had forty thousand stalls, and 2 chronicles says he had four thousand? And Septuagint says he had forty thousand brood mares!

3,951 posted on 03/22/2006 9:32:21 PM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: stripes1776

I meant to ping you to #3951.


3,953 posted on 03/23/2006 3:30:31 AM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: kosta50; Forest Keeper; annalex; Kolokotronis; Agrarian; jo kus
But, you bring up another interesting point: if the Bible is inerrant (i.e. if there are no errors due to translation or misconception or miscopying, etc.) how could two versions of the same Bible use two different words that mean similar but not identical concepts?

The reason two versions of the same Bible uses two different words is due to the nature of Greek syntax. The Greek tacks the verb onto the end of a word and it isn't always precise. I don't have my reference books handy but to give you an idea, the Greek could use one word that could be correctly interpreted as:

As you can see by the above example the meaning can be different depending on how the Greek is interpreted. Usually these differences are insignificant. Occasionally they can be important.

To make this more confusing, there are subtle differences in the various Greek manuscripts used as the basis for the translation. In these cases, a good translation will footnote the changes or the differences in the manuscripts. With a very few exceptions most people don't base their doctrine on these suspected text that I know of.

If you only have one person doing the translation you can understand how they may want to shade the text to their own preference using their favorite word or using the manuscript they like the most. Nowadays whenever a new translation is coming out you have international boards of various denominations including Catholics, who participate in the translation. They generally look at the context and map it against other parts of scriptures and other manuscripts. But in the end they come to some educated consensus.

Protestants believe it's the original documents that are the inspired writings of God-not the translations. I would argue this confusion is EXACTLY as God has intended and reminds me very much of the tower of Babel.

The second point you bring up is far more intriguing in my mind-the Jewish idea of righteousness. The Pharisees believed in a resurrection of the dead-not the Sadducees. Jesus told the Sadducees they were wrong and condemned the Pharisees for their legalism. So the Jewish idea of righteousness wasn't as far removed or different than you might think. It is clear in the scripture this idea of righteousness was transferred over to Christians.

What I do believe has changed is our concept of God. We no longer think like our Jewish-believing brethren but we think in the more Greek way. Our concept has become skewed.

3,954 posted on 03/23/2006 5:40:35 AM PST by HarleyD ("A man's steps are from the Lord, How then can man understand his way?" Prov 20:24 (HNV))
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To: kosta50; annalex; Kolokotronis; Agrarian; HarleyD; jo kus; Dr. Eckleburg
The quote was from KJV. My OT Bible (LXX, Septuagint) says this:

"I am he that prepared light, and formed darkness; who make peace, and create evil; I am the Lord God, that does all these things." [Esaias 45:7]

The Greek word used is derived from Greek kakos, meaning "of bad nature" or "wicked." In the Hebrew version the word ra` is used meaning "bad" or "evil."

I know it was from the KJV. I brought it up because I thought I remembered you saying the KJV was a bad translation earlier. I wondered why you were quoting it now. Plus, why does your own Greek version use "evil" if you distinguish between the Greek and the Hebrew?

Since we are no this subject, maybe you can explain how come 2 Kings 8:26 says Ahaziah was 22 years old and 2 Chron 22:2 says he was 42 when he became king? , In my NIV, both verses say he was 22 years old. If you want to just declare that wrong, so you can declare that there is a conflict, then I can't stop you.

2 Sam 6:23 says Michal had no children and 2 Sam 21:8 says she had five!, ...

There does not appear to be universal agreement on whether these are the same people or not. My Bible says the latter is Merab, but acknowledges that there is disagreement. I would hardly call that a slam dunk.

4,079 posted on 03/27/2006 12:48:35 AM PST by Forest Keeper
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