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To: Claud

>>Ok tell you what, you pick your favorite one of Gendron's best/strongest points, and we'll hash it out a bit.<<

I don't expect to change your mind, nor should you expect to change mine, but ok. Let's try this one:

"The pope said he represented Jesus Christ, yet he lived in stark
contrast to the Savior who had no place to lay His head. He
denied Jesus was man's Creator by teaching evolution is true.
On several occasions he denied that Jesus was the only way to
the Father. When he addressed Muslim leaders, he said there is
"a common spiritual bond that unites us." In 1999 he denied the
blood of Jesus was the only purification for sin by awarding a
plenary indulgence for anyone who quit smoking or drinking
alcohol. John Paul is acclaimed as a great moral leader, yet
he failed to discipline American Bishops for tolerating the
wicked sexual abuse of deviant priests."

So - did the Pope claim that evolution was true, did he fail to discipline the sexually confused Bishops, did he award a "plenary indulgence", does he accept the worship of men as "Holy Father", and did he or did he not play footsie with the Muslims, kissing the Koran and claiming a "unity in spirit" with them?


56 posted on 12/29/2005 6:32:41 AM PST by ItsOurTimeNow ("Hail Him who saved you by His grace, and crown Him Lord of All")
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To: ItsOurTimeNow
So - did the Pope claim that evolution was true,

He did no such thing; and still less did he do what Gendron ridiculously suggested was denying that Jesus is our creator by doing so. It is a dogma of the Catholic faith that man was created by God, period, end of discussion. Questions of how he was created and by what means (whether immediately or through some kind of descent) are interesting, but the Christian's sanctity does not stand or fall on them.

did he fail to discipline the sexually confused Bishops

As a matter of fact, yes, I believe his reign was marked by a regrettable laxity in discipline. If that is an automatic sign of damnation, God have mercy on all our souls.

did he award a "plenary indulgence"

Plenary indulgences are awarded all the time for certain pious acts. But in Catholic theology, they come directly from Christ's blood atonement in purification for sin, and are in no way, shape, matter, or form separate from same. The Church has no power save that was given Her by Christ.

does he accept the worship of men as "Holy Father"

He accepted the title "Holy Father" and he rejected the idolatrous worhip of men. The one does not imply the other any more than "Holy Bible" implies a worship of books.

and did he or did he not play footsie with the Muslims, kissing the Koran and claiming a "unity in spirit" with them?

The Koran incident, if it was reported accurately, was scandalous and should in no way have been done. Plenty of Catholics on this forum will agree with that. But how it proves he was damned, I still have no idea.

58 posted on 12/29/2005 9:17:00 AM PST by Claud
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