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To: Desdemona; NYer; sitetest; gbcdoj
***Looks to me, after living here my whole life and knowing the WHOLE history of this little affair, that the Poles were in violation of Canon Law for over 100 years***

All that you know is nowhere near "the WHOLE history".

What Burke tried was not to "correct" anything, but grab more power for himself. The irony of the situation is that the assets of St. Stanislaus parish are much safer for the next generations of Catholics in the hands of the lay board than they would be in the hands of Burke. And a second part of the irony is that if the property was turned over to the diocese it would legally become personal property at the disposal of the bishop alone, but as long as it is run by the board of trustees it cannot be legally used for personal financial gain of any of the individual members.

And... the Poles couldn't be in violation of Canon Law for over 100 years because the Canon Law was first promulgated in 1917, and then fundamentally revised, to what Burke "quotes", in 1983. So, we are talking about 22 years compared to 125 years of the parish's history. There are canons in it, omitted by Burke, that say he is dead wrong.

If he doesn't wanna be a bishop to these people, then he doesn't have to. It's a free country.

20 posted on 12/26/2005 8:22:26 AM PST by I Believe It's Not Butter
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To: I Believe It's Not Butter
Canon Law was first promulgated in 1917

Incorrect: Canon Law.

You are probably thinking of the first codification of Canon Law, which was completed in 1917 and promulgated by Pope Benedict XVI. This was revised and re-issued by John Paul II in 1983. But canon law itself dates back to the fourth century or even earlier.

if the property was turned over to the diocese it would legally become personal property at the disposal of the bishop alone

This is completely false, and you've been corrected on this before. Have you no concern for the truth?

Archdiocese Proposal for the St. Stanislaus Parish Structure:

St. Stanislaus Kostka Catholic Church
(New Parish Corporation)

•A new Missouri nonprofit corporation based on the model for all other parishes of the Archdiocese of St. Louis
•Leases parish property from the Irrevocable Parish Trust with no payment of rent
•Operates the Parish with full responsibility for maintenance of parish facilities
•Receives transfers of funds from the Irrevocable Parish Trust for operation of the Parish


St. Stanislaus Kostka Catholic Church Fund
(Irrevocable Parish Trust)

•A new charitable Trust formed by the Archbishop of St. Louis
•Archbishop appoints trustees who must all be parishioners, plus the Pastor who is a trustee, ex officio
•Holds and invests cash and securities for the Parish
•Transfers funds to the Parish Corporation, upon the request of the Pastor, for parish needs
•Holds title to parish real estate which it leases to the Parish Corporation
•Maintains $500,000 endowment for the upkeep of parish facilities
•If the Parish closes, transfers all parish assets to the Residuary Corporation (the present parish corporation renamed)


Polish Roman Catholic St. Stanislaus Parish Fund
(Residuary Corporation and Present Parish Corporation)

•Present parish corporation which will amend its Articles of Incorporation and Bylaws to be the residuary recipient of the parish assets if the Parish should close
•Present directors, except the pastor, remain as directors
•Parishioners elect successor directors who must all be parishioners
•Transfers all of its assets, except $10,000, to the Irrevocable Parish Trust
•Unless the Parish closes, will have no current activities, conduct no fundraising and hold no more than $10,000 in assets
•Would receive parish assets, if Parish would close, and would then administer parish assets for religious, educational and charitable activities for Catholics of Polish descent in the Archdiocese of St. Louis
•Has authority to enforce the obligation of the Irrevocable Parish Trust to use parish assets for the purposes of the trust and to transfer parish assets to it, if the Parish closes


25 posted on 12/26/2005 8:36:16 AM PST by gbcdoj (Let us ask the Lord with tears, that according to his will so he would shew his mercy to us Jud 8:17)
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To: I Believe It's Not Butter
If he doesn't wanna be a bishop to these people, then he doesn't have to. It's a free country.

Living in a 'free country' does not even factor into this situation. Religious living in communist countries follow the same vows of obedience. Bishop Burke exercised his responsibility as bishop; the priest and Parish Trustees refused to obey. The bishop spent 2 years attempting to resolve this matter, even bringing a Polish bishop to the parish to explain matters in their native tongue. The Parish Trustees remained defiant.

Issuing an edict of Excommunication is a very painful thing for any bishop to do. It was done with a 'heavy heart'. Are you a member of this parish?

35 posted on 12/26/2005 9:32:21 AM PST by NYer ("Socialism is the religion people get when they lose their religion")
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To: I Believe It's Not Butter
If he doesn't wanna be a bishop to these people, then he doesn't have to. It's a free country.

Your interpretation of freedom is fundamentally Protestant. True freedom is the freedom to do what is right, not the freedom to do whatever you please. That's the Catholic understanding anyway. The Archbishop, by the way, doesn't have a choice as to which flock he leads. Let us put aside the fact that he is legally obliged to obey the Pope in such matters. Spiritually speaking, it is God Himself who appoints shepherds to tend His sheep.

Let's say the Archbishop is a money and power-hungry glob, and you don't agree with his interpretation of the canons. So what. The Archbishop's authority comes from the Apostles. Tell me, by what authority do you sit in judgment of the law?

This is the essence of Catholicism. I find that too many American Catholics fall prey to contemporary social sensibilities concerning freedom of conscience, judgment, authority, etc.
40 posted on 12/26/2005 9:57:03 AM PST by Lilllabettt
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To: I Believe It's Not Butter; Desdemona

IBINB--fair warning:

It's not kewl to contradict the Leading Member of the TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary.

In fact, it can result in hot--not cool.

Des is a lot closer to the situation than you are, and DOES happen to know the facts.

Which brings up the question: are you a Roman Catholic?


41 posted on 12/26/2005 9:58:32 AM PST by ninenot (Minister of Membership, Tomas Torquemada Gentlemen's Club)
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To: I Believe It's Not Butter
And a second part of the irony is that if the property was turned over to the diocese it would legally become personal property at the disposal of the bishop alone,

Not on this archdiocese. Before Burke got here, under Rigali, it was all put in trust so that it couldn't be seized by the state.

Burke doesn't do power grabs. He has a lot to learn about diplomacy and knowing how to say the right thing at the right time, but there is no way the man is power hungry. Sorry. Don't believe that.

97 posted on 12/27/2005 4:18:02 AM PST by Desdemona (A belated Merry Christmas to everyone.)
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To: I Believe It's Not Butter; Desdemona; sitetest; gbcdoj; ninenot; sittnick
IBINB: You are STILL not a Catholic (nor is the schismatic and excommunicated Fr. Bozo or his schismatic and excommunicated "trustees" or their local sycophants) and it is STILL NONE OF YOUR ANTI-CATHOLIC BUSINESS.

Without TERRITORIAL jurisdiction which comes from the pope through the duly serving diocesan ordinary, Fr. Bozo has no business acting as a preacher, a priest, a confessor in the absence of actual emergency (i,e,. coming upon the dying accident victim) within the Archdiocese of St. Louis where he is NOT incardinated or now in the Diocese of Springfield-Cape Girardeau where he has been suspended by his diocesan ordinary. Just what was his emergency???? That the cash bar frequented by parents on premises during the "CCD" classes might otherwise close????? Bozek and his flock are Judases and should be treated accordingly.

111 posted on 12/27/2005 12:34:17 PM PST by BlackElk (Dean of Discipline of the Tomas de Torquemada Gentlemen's Club)
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