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To: Clemenza
I wouldn't say Mara was ignorant,

You can believe that the moon is made out of cheese if you want, too. Your belief doesn't change the fact that it isn't or that Marajade is indeed ignorant.

The BIBLE and early christian tradition teach that one must publicly testify their sins to fellow believers, NOT to some guy who Rome designates as a cleric,

Unfortunately for you and all the other self proclaimed "Bible experts" here, Christ, St. Matthew, St. John and St. Paul, disagree with you.

"And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose upon earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven." Matthew 16:18-19

"Amen I say to you, whatsoever you shall bind upon earth, shall be bound also in heaven; and whatsoever you shall loose upon earth, shall be loosed also in heaven." Matthew 18:18

"When he had said this, he breathed on them; and he said to them: Receive ye the Holy Ghost. Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained." John 20:22-23

"But all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Christ; and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation. For God indeed was in Christ, reconciling the world to himself, not imputing to them their sins; and he hath placed in us the word of reconciliation. For Christ therefore we are ambassadors, God as it were exhorting by us. For Christ, we beseech you, be reconciled to God. Him, who knew no sin, he hath made sin for us, that we might be made the justice of God in him." 2 Corinthians 5:18-21

The following also disagree with you.

"Let us not listen to those who deny that the Church of God has power to forgive all sins" St. Augustine

rebuking the Novatianists who "professed to show reverence for the Lord by reserving to Him alone the power of forgiving sins. Greater wrong could not be done than what they do in seeking to rescind His commands and fling back the office He bestowed. . . . The Church obeys Him in both respects, by binding sin and by loosing it; for the Lord willed that for both the power should be equal" St. Ambrose

"It seemed impossible that sins should be forgiven through penance; Christ granted this (power) to the Apostles and from the Apostles it has been transmitted to the office of priests" St. Ambrose

"God makes no distinction; He promised mercy to all and to His priests He granted the authority to pardon without any exception" St. Ambrose

"This (forgiving sins), you say, only God can do. Quite true: but what He does through His priests is the doing of His own power" St. Pacien

"Men filled with the spirit of God (i.e. priests) forgive sins in two ways, either by admitting to baptism those who are worthy or by pardoning the penitent children of the Church" St. Cyril of Alexandria

the priest's power of forgiving sins "penetrates to the soul and reaches up to heaven". Wherefore, he concludes, "it were manifest folly to condemn so great a power without which we can neither obtain heaven nor come to the fulfillment of the promises. . . . Not only when they (the priests) regenerate us (baptism), but also after our new birth, they can forgive us our sins" St. John Chrysostom

"As the man whom the priest baptizes is enlightened by the grace of the Holy Ghost, so does he who in penance confesses his sins, receive through the priest forgiveness in virtue of the grace of Christ" St. Athanasius

It was such intolerance and blind faithfulness to practices not mentioned in the scriptures or practiced by the Church pre-Nicea that drove me away from the RC Church.

Quid est veritas? You left of your own free will. Reject the truth if you wish but don't try and use the Church and your ignorance of Scripture and history as scapegoats for your decision.

88 posted on 11/20/2005 6:17:21 AM PST by A.A. Cunningham
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To: A.A. Cunningham; Clemenza

Are all protestants ignorant? I really want it clarified.


112 posted on 11/20/2005 11:08:41 AM PST by marajade (Yes, I'm a SW freak!)
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