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To: kosta50

Interesting verbage from OrthodoxWiki (not real sure the authority of the content there): http://www.orthodoxwiki.org/Fourth_Ecumenical_Council

"Regarding the second misunderstanding, the Orthodox do not accept the doctrine of Papal authority as established in 1870 by the Vatican Council and taught in the Roman Catholic Church today. But neither do they deny Rome its place of primacy, as she is first among honor as set up by the second Council. It was Rome, after all, who stayed most true to the faith during many of the heresies over the centuries. Where the Orthodox see Rome going wrong is when they turned this place of 'primacy' in love (as St. Ignatius called it) into a place of supremacy of external jurisdiction and power. And so the primacy assigned to Rome does not overthrow the essential quality of all bishops. The Pope may be the 'first Bishop in the Church,' but he is first among equals."


135 posted on 11/21/2005 7:31:34 AM PST by x5452
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To: x5452; Kolokotronis; Agrarian
Interesting verbage from OrthodoxWiki (not real sure the authority of the content there

That is absolutely correct. The Orthodox Church recognizes that (Old) Rome carries the primacy of the elder brother, but no jurisdictional authority over the entire Church. It is, indeed the first-in-love concept.

The Undivided Church recognized the Bishop of [Old] Rome (aka the Pope of Rome) as the first in honor and privilege, followed by second in honor and equal priviledge the Bishop of Constantinople [New Rome]. This recognition is not optional -- it obligatory because it was proclaimed by an Ecumenical Council (as well as by an Imperial Decree at another time).

This privileged status among Patriarchs belong to these two because of Rome and Constantinople became impirial capitals respectively, and for no other reason. The Unidivided Church never proclaimed (through an Ecumenical Council) that the Bishop of Old Rome was in any way scripturally entitled to greater jurisdictional authority over other Patriarchs; he was jurisdictionally supreme only in the western Patriarchate.

The real schism between the East and the West occurred at Vatican I, when the Pope of Rome proclaimed himself inerrant (ex cathedra) as a dogma unknown to the Undivided Church. This Latin innovation did more to assure no reconcilliation was possible than any other issue. The Latin Church, of course, taught imperial papacy, and the "Viccar of Christ" model ever since the Great Schism, but it was never a matter of dogma unil 1870.

136 posted on 11/21/2005 8:45:00 AM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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