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To: Cvengr

Of course He. is. But, I think we could actually reach a consensus that He doesn't generally come town to earth in that living and breathing form to straighten out our messes lately. He has too much respect for our free will than to do that, for, clearly, if Jesus did such a thing, the whole world would be compelled to obedience by irrefutable evidence of His existence, and faith wouldn't have any bearing on the equation anymore.

That's not His way. He prefers that we "contend for the faith" (Jude 1:3) *as* a faith, not as an elegantly laid-out proof as in a geometry class. He set in place Peter as His vicar, to rule the Church in His stead. Peter was not God, neither were any of his successors. Yet he and they were empowered by Jesus to act with His full authority (Matt. 16:18-19; Luke 22:32; John 21:15-17). To a lesser extent, the rest of the apostles shared that authority (Matthew 28:20; John 20:21-23). Certainly, our very discussion proves that it is within the realm of possibility for differing factions to "contend" over the authority of mere men, even if one side thinks there's clear evidence of their status as having been deputized by God Himself!

Jesus is alive and breathing; amazingly, we both agree on that. ;-) But He reigns in heaven in glory, and will not come for His own in "alive and breathing" form until the end of the age. He left us His physical presence via the Eucharist in the mean time, and left the running of His alive and breathing Church to His alive and breathing representatives: the popes and bishops, successors of Peter and the rest of the apostles, who are aided in their decisions by the Holy Spirit. Your argument is basically a straw man, if you claim we assign too much authority to mere men. No one claims they are God. They merely act in His stead, as per His design. If you have issues with that, you need to take them up with God Himself. Meanwhile, the rest of us flesh and blood members of Christ's Body, the Church, will continue to contend for Him.


127 posted on 11/14/2005 6:22:16 AM PST by magisterium
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To: magisterium

I agree with you in many things stated. I also love the relationship available to man through our Lord and Savior Christ Jesus. Namely, as believers in fellowship with Him, we all have a priesthood through our High Priest, Christ Jesus with the Father. No other person will fulfill that role as High Priest.

I also have no doubt that many within the heirarchy of Roman Catholicism may indeed hold holy functions to God through faith in or Lord and Savior Christ Jesus. If some within the Roman Catholic Church have performed His will in bringing Scripture to other believers, including the Gospels, then I rejoice at their work through faith in Him.


128 posted on 11/14/2005 6:34:59 AM PST by Cvengr (<;^))
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