AJC asks Catholics not to convert Jews

Jerusalem Post ^ | MATTHEW WAGNER

[Antioch]

The Catholic Church should categorically reject any attempts to convert Jews, the American Jewish Committee's Rabbi David Rosen said Thursday. "Even though the Nostra Aetate says that no attempts should be made to convert Jews, many Catholics continue to express a hope for conversion," he told The Jerusalem Post from Rome during the Vatican's 40th anniversary celebration of the Nostra Aetate document, which revolutionized the Catholic Church's relations with Jews.

Rosen, the AJC's international director of interreligious affairs, has been involved in Vatican-Israeli negotiations for more than a decade. He and Cardinal Jean-Marie Lustiger, a retired Paris Archbishop and Jewish convert, were to be the keynote speakers Thursday evening.

Cardinal Walter Kasper, president of the Holy See's Commission for Religious Relations with Jewry, is hosting the event. The Nostra Aetate was one of the key documents to emerge from the 1962-65 Second Vatican Council meeting of Catholics and clergy that modernized the Catholic Church. In it, the Vatican deplored anti-Semitism in every form and repudiated the deicide charge that blamed the Jews for Christ's death. Rosen, commenting on the issue of Catholic proselytizing, said many prominent Church theologians such as Kasper consider any attempts to convert Jews, even unobtrusive invitations, inappropriate and unnecessary.

"But some theologians, like Cardinal [Avery] Dulles interpret the Nostra Aetate differently," he said. "Although they eschew proselytizing, they hold that an open invitation to convert is permitted." Rosen said differences of opinion on conversion of Jews might stem from varying theological positions on redemption for Jews.

Catholic theologians who hope for the conversion of Jews believe that although Jews are not condemned by God, they are not in His favor. Therefore, it is legitimate to hope for Jews conversion to Catholicism. Those who reject conversion as inappropriate and unnecessary would be more likely to accept the idea that Jews are eligible for spiritual redemption in the world to come, he said.

Notwithstanding his criticism on the issue of conversions, Rosen called the Nostra Aetate a "mind-boggling revolution in the Catholic Church's theology." "This might sound like a hyperbole, but there is nothing quite comparable in the history of humankind," he said. "Imagine a billion followers who had been taught contempt for the Jews and Judaism, who had been inculcated with the idea that the Jew was in league with the devil, suddenly being taught that the Jews are the people of the covenant. Or as Pope John Paul II put it, the Jews are 'our dearly beloved older brother.'"

Rosen said the Nostra Aetate also opened the way for diplomatic relations between the State of Israel and the Vatican by recognizing the land of Israel as the ancestral home of the Jewish people. "Thanksgiving to God is appropriate for the incredible turnaround in Church thought," he said.

Several ceremonies are scheduled for next week in Israel. The Center for the Study of Christianity at Hebrew University will sponsor a three-day conference on various aspects of the document. Rabbi Shear Yishuv Hacohen, president of the Bilateral Commission for Dialogue between the Vatican and the Chief Rabbinate of Israel, will speak at the AJC's headquarters in Jerusalem and there will be a special ceremony at Beit Hanassi.

Rosen will be honored with the Mount Zion Award 2005 on the occasion of the Nostra Aetate anniversary for his contribution to reconciliation between Jews and Catholics. The award will be presented by Kasper.

[Antioch]

French Cardinal Jean-Marie Lustiger, left, greets Rabbi David Rosen, during a a commemoration of the "Nostra Aetate" document of the Second Vatican Council, in Rome on Thursday.

Nostra Aetate was the Declaration on the Relation of the Church with Non-Christian Religions of Vatican II promulgated in 1965 by Pope Paul VI. The implications of Nostra Aetate, however, can only be properly understood in the light of subsequent Vatican documents and papal statements. For example, Pope John Paul II's later writings on this document could be construed to suggest that Christ has not fulfilled the Old Covenant, raising profound implications for the whole question of proselytizing. To this interpretive ambiguity, Rabbi Rosen has repeatedly stated that Nostra Aetate declares that "no attempts should be made to convert Jews." (and apparently Kasper will honour Rosen with an award for this attitude). Another example of the murky waters of Vatican II de-catholicizing the mission of the Church.

[PetroniusMaximus]

I would rather follow Paul...

I am speaking the truth in Christ--I am not lying; my conscience bears me witness in the Holy Spirit-- that I have great sorrow and unceasing anguish in my heart. For I could wish that I myself were accursed and cut off from Christ for the sake of my brothers, my kinsmen according to the flesh.
...
Brothers, my heart's desire and prayer to God for them is that they may be saved. I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge. For, being ignorant of the righteousness that comes from God, and seeking to establish their own, they did not submit to God's righteousness. For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.
...
As regards the gospel, they are enemies of God for your sake. But as regards election, they are beloved for the sake of their forefathers. For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. Just as you were at one time disobedient to God but now have received mercy because of their disobedience, so they too have now been disobedient in order that by the mercy shown to you they also may now receive mercy.

Rom 9, 10 & 11

[SaltyJoe]

Jews don't have to become Roman Catholics to love Jesus.

[son of caesar]

your post reflects what ive always thought, good job. as far as these pronouncements from on high and not gods high, oh well, mice do love to play when the cat is away.

[SaltyJoe]

I'm not Jewish, but I owe my Salvation to the Jews. The Catholic Sacraments are rooted in Jewish Tradition and Law as instituted by Jesus, the Super Jew, Himself. I wish I had a Jewish wife, maybe that's a curse, but us Catholics believe that suffering is a path to Holiness (isn't that another copyrighted Jewish tradition?). I'm circumsized if that important do I need a witness is there a rabbi in the house? I'd tell you how I got circumsized, but it's a long story (pun intended). If I have to wait for the 2nd Coming then I'm sure it's because I'm paying for the sins of my youth.

Thus said, I'm thankful for Jews, Israelis, all of those kids Abraham spawned and especially for the shorty on the left:



Name, rank, and telephone number please.

[kosta50]

Catholic theologians who hope for the conversion of Jews believe that although Jews are not condemned by God, they are not in His favor

Not surprisingly, in their own words, the Jerusalem Post summed up their misunderstanding of how Christ changed the way we know God.

Condemnation (which we bring upon ourselves) is not limited to non-Christians, but to those who claim to be Christian as well.

The people Rabbi Rosen should be addressing are the so-called Christian Zionists, Evangelical fundamentalists, the so-called Religious Right, who wield substantial power where it counts -- when it comes to America's support for Israel. They openly express hope that all Jews will convert before the End of Times. They also actively proselytize.

For this reason it is doubtful that Rabbi Rosen will criticize the Religious Right. Catholics on the other hand are a different story: the Catholic Church is not as politically correct as those Evangelical Zionists.

[SampleMan]

Is the AJC suggesting that Jews have lost their free will?

[Conservative til I die]

Keeping the kosher laws is the Jews for Jesus evangelical sect's big gimmicks. What's with all the gimmicks?

[SaltyJoe]

"gimmicks?"

I'm not Jewish, so I can't answer for Jews.

If I were to parallel the respect for tradition, I do rise and stand at attention when our National Anthem plays. If I'm wearing a hat, I take it off and place it over my heart.

Perhaps the kosher and Mosaic laws, though born of necessity in many cases, are kept to demonstrate personal and communal devotion to Our Eternal Creator? Before that, there was Natural Law--the Law upon which all righteous laws grow.

If others know better, please tell and let me stand corrected. :-)

[NYer]

The Catholic Church should categorically reject any attempts to convert Jews, the American Jewish Committee's Rabbi David Rosen said Thursday.

Here too, I recall Roy Schoeman, author of Salvation is from the Jews. His conversion did not come about as a result of proselytization by the Church or christian friends, but directly from God. Once he assimilated the experience, he approached a catholic priest requesting to be baptized into the Catholic Church. The priest, out of respect for the view espoused by Rabbi David Rosen, sent him away with the admonition to be the "best Jew you can be". Mr. Schoeman knocked on several other doors before one priest took him seriously and baptized him into the Catholic Church. Free will must override political correctness.

[AlaninSA]

Hey, if the Mormons, Baptists, Jehovahs Witnesses and others can attempt to lure our members...we're more than free to do the same for others.

I've no issue with the Jewish faith. My Lord and Savior was Jewish.

I'd like to see more people of ANY faith (or lack thereof) get to know Him.

[Conservative til I die]

If I were to parallel the respect for tradition, I do rise and stand at attention when our National Anthem plays. If I'm wearing a hat, I take it off and place it over my heart.

Apples and oranges. Standing and removing your hat for the National Anthem is something we do because it is our current nation, current anthem, something that is being done in current times and is applicable because we are citizens of the United States of America.

A better analogy would be to compare Christians keeping the kosher laws to Americans standing and removing their hats for God Save the Queen and bowing down to the Queen of England, or better yet, doing a Native American rain dance to the National Anthem.

There is absolutely NO tradition of Christians keeping the kosher laws past maybe the first two centuries of Christian history. Maybe less, but I'll make a liberal estimate.

Perhaps the kosher and Mosaic laws, though born of necessity in many cases, are kept to demonstrate personal and communal devotion to Our Eternal Creator?

Like I said, there's no tradition of it, but Evangelicals ignore everything that happened in Christian history from the end of the Book of Revelations until the day their particular church was established. It's completely unnecessary to keep the kosher laws. Like I said, it's just a gimmick. Every evangelical sect seems to need their own gimmick to make them "special", whether it's refusing medical treatment, worshipping on Saturdays, refusing blood transfusions, keeping the kosher laws, etc.

Take away the Judaism gimmick from the Jews for Jesus sect, and they're run of the mill Baptists.

BTW, Natural Law and the kosher laws are two different things and don't really relate to one another here.

[Unam Sanctam]

So long as there is no coercion, it is a matter of free speech to evangelize anyone and everyone to believe in Christ and the true Faith.

[Conservative til I die]

"gimmicks?" I'm not Jewish, so I can't answer for Jews.

BTW, I'm not attacking Jewish kosher laws. While the kosher laws are no longer necessary, it's only natural for Jews to follow them, since they don't follow the New Testament. My post about the "gimmick" only applies to Jews for Jesus.

Just in case anyone wanted to start making accusations of anti-semitism.

[Conservative til I die]

So long as there is no coercion, it is a matter of free speech to evangelize anyone and everyone to believe in Christ and the true Faith.

I believe evangelization works best when the "target" is open to it. I'm not big on the whole door-to-door, lovebombing thing you see from the cults. Example and honest conversation are the best way to make converts.

[x5452]

Did not Christ say go preach the good news to the Jews?

[NYer]

I would rather follow Paul... Rom 9, 10 & 11

You have left out, perhaps, the most important message from Paul to the Romans, regarding the "ingrafting" of the Jews.

Romans
Chapter 11

1

¹ I ask, then, has God rejected his people? Of course not! For I too am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.

2

God has not rejected his people whom he foreknew. Do you not know what the scripture says about Elijah, how he pleads with God against Israel?

3

"Lord, they have killed your prophets, they have torn down your altars, and I alone am left, and they are seeking my life."

4

But what is God's response to him? "I have left for myself seven thousand men who have not knelt to Baal."

5

So also at the present time there is a remnant, chosen by grace.

6

But if by grace, it is no longer because of works; otherwise grace would no longer be grace.

7

What then? What Israel was seeking it did not attain, but the elect attained it; the rest were hardened,

8

as it is written: "God gave them a spirit of deep sleep, eyes that should not see and ears that should not hear, down to this very day."

9

And David says: "Let their table become a snare and a trap, a stumbling block and a retribution for them;

10

let their eyes grow dim so that they may not see, and keep their backs bent forever."

St. Paul states that God Himself "darkened" the eyes of the Jews, that they might not recognize Jesus as the Messiah, even down to the present time. It was part of God's Providence that some Jews should remain unable to recognize Jesus as the Messiah. Paul then intimates the purpose ....

11

² Hence I ask, did they stumble so as to fall? Of course not! But through their transgression salvation has come to the Gentiles, so as to make them jealous.

12

Now if their transgression is enrichment for the world, and if their diminished number is enrichment for the Gentiles, how much more their full number.

St. Paul implies that the Jews' rejection of Jesus was in itself part of the process that enabled salvation to come to the Gentiles. And their rejection of Jesus was not the end of their own salvation.

13

Now I am speaking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch then as I am the apostle to the Gentiles, I glory in my ministry

14

in order to make my race jealous and thus save some of them.

15

For if their rejection is the reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead?

16

³ If the firstfruits are holy, so is the whole batch of dough; and if the root is holy, so are the branches.

Verse 15 repeats that it was the Jews' rejection of Jesus that brought about the salvation of the Gentiles and that if such a great blessing was the result of the Jews rejecting Jesus, how great must be the blessing that will come about as a result of their accepting Him!

17

But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, a wild olive shoot, were grafted in their place and have come to share in the rich root of the olive tree,

18

do not boast against the branches. If you do boast, consider that you do not support the root; the root supports you.

19

Indeed you will say, "Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in."

20

That is so. They were broken off because of unbelief, but you are there because of faith. So do not become haughty, but stand in awe.

Here is the central image. Some branches were broken off of the cultivated tree and wil shoots grafted on in their place. The implication is that they were intentionally broken off by God. These branches are of course the Jews who reject Jesus. Paul suggests that this was part of God's plan.

21

For if God did not spare the natural branches, (perhaps) he will not spare you either.

22

See, then, the kindness and severity of God: severity toward those who fell, but God's kindness to you, provided you remain in his kindness; otherwise you too will be cut off.

This is a warning to the Gentile Christians not to see their faith as superiority over the Jews.

23

And they also, if they do not remain in unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.

24

For if you were cut from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and grafted, contrary to nature, into a cultivated one, how much more will they who belong to it by nature be grafted back into their own olive tree.

And here is the beautiful promise that when the Jews return to the fullness of their faith, the Church, they will thus be grafted back onto what has always been their own native root.

25

⁴ I do not want you to be unaware of this mystery, brothers, so that you will not become wise (in) your own estimation: a hardening has come upon Israel in part, until the full number of the Gentiles comes in,

26

and thus all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "The deliverer will come out of Zion, he will turn away godlessness from Jacob;

27

and this is my covenant with them when I take away their sins."

Again, the statement that the unbelief of the Jews was an integral part of God's plan to enable the Gentiles to be saved. After which the "hardening" resulting in the Jews' unbelief will be removed and "all Israel will be saved".

28

In respect to the gospel, they are enemies on your account; but in respect to election, they are beloved because of the patriarchs.

29

For the gifts and the call of God are irrevocable.

Paul repeats that the Jews' rejection was for the sake of the Gentiles.

30

⁵ Just as you once disobeyed God but have now received mercy because of their disobedience,

31

so they have now disobeyed in order that, by virtue of the mercy shown to you, they too may (now) receive mercy.

32

For God delivered all to disobedience, that he might have mercy upon all.

Paul repeats the assertion that this was mysteriously part of God's plan so that the Gentiles might be saved.

33

⁶ Oh, the depth of the riches and wisdom and knowledge of God! How inscrutable are his judgments and how unsearchable his ways!

34

"For who has known the mind of the Lord ⁷ or who has been his counselor?"

35

⁸ "Or who has given him anything that he may be repaid?"

36

For from him and through him and for him are all things. To him be glory forever. Amen.

Almost every Jew who enters the Catholic Church feels deeply the sense of "return" that St. Paul captures in his image of the olive branch being grafted back on to its original, natural root - that they are in no way leaving Judaism but rather coming into its fullness. As Rosalind Ross, a Jewish-Catholic evangelist put it, becoming Catholic is "the most Jewish thing a person can do."

Source: Salvation is from the Jews, by Roy Schoeman

[NYer]

Click on above image for link to their web site.

[Do not dub me shapka broham]

http://jewsforjudaism.com/

[SaltyJoe]

Thanks for the link.

http://jewsforjudaism.com/web/pdf/RealMessiahBookPages_v4ab.pdf

I'll have to read more of their literature (especially page 5). Some things concerning debate are indeed pointless, like two landlocked men who've never seen an ocean arguing whether it's blue or green in color.