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To: PetroniusMaximus

Respectfully, Petronius Maximus, this is changing the subject. Are you saying that a believer who murders must repent in order to be forgiven and go to heaven?


243 posted on 09/20/2005 4:10:20 PM PDT by InterestedQuestioner ("Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved.")
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To: InterestedQuestioner
***Respectfully, Petronius Maximus, this is changing the subject.***

Actually I'm not. The question is right o­n topic for our discussion - though it may not be clear just yet.

So, when were your (or anyone's) sins forgiven by God?

 


and to prove I'm not dodging...

***Are you saying that a believer who murders must repent in order to be forgiven and go to heaven?***

A believer who has been:

reborn of the Spirit of God,

who has been justified,

who has been blessed in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places,

who has been chosen in Christ before the foundation of the world, that he should be holy and blameless before God.

who, in love has been predestined for adoption through Jesus Christ,

who has redemption through Christ's blood,

who has the forgiveness of their trespasses, according to the riches of God's grace,
  
who, in Christ, has obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will,

who has heard the word of truth, the gospel of salvation, and believed in Christ,

who has been sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, (the guarantee of their inheritance until they acquire possession of it,)

who even when they were dead in their trespasses, was made alive together with Christ (by grace they have been saved)

who have been raised up with Christ and seated with him in the heavenly places so that in the coming ages they might show the immeasurable riches of God's grace in kindness toward them in Christ Jesus.

who by grace have been saved through faith. (And this is not their own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no o­ne may boast),

who is God's workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that that should walk in them.

(read that stuff and let it sink in IQ... - don't just skim it!)

... if that person were, for whatever reason, to commit murder - God forbid - then Christ would pray for that person, that their faith would not fail them, and the Holy Spirit would create such sorrow in their hearts as to prevail upon them to confess their sin and accept the forgiveness won for them by virtue of Christ's death o­n their behalf in 33 AD to pay the just penalty for that sin in order that not o­ne of Christ's sheep would perish.

If, when this person was utterly lost and cut off from God, they were the recepients of His mercy and grace in the free gift of  new birth and salvation - how could their subsequent lack of personal righteousness effect the security of that free gift?


 If Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say?

"Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness."

Now to the o­ne who works, his wages are not counted as a gift but as his due. And to the o­ne who does not work but trusts him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness, just as David also speaks of the blessing of the o­ne to whom God counts righteousness apart from works:

"Blessed are those whose lawless deeds are forgiven,
and whose sins are covered;
blessed is the man against whom the Lord will not count his sin."

244 posted on 09/20/2005 7:24:57 PM PDT by PetroniusMaximus
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