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To: PetroniusMaximus
Well, the faith is the key. The Catholic teaching is that works without faith is vanity; at the same time, faith without works is dead:
James 2

20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, offering up Isaac his son upon the altar?

22 Seest thou that faith did cooperate with his works and by works faith was made perfect?

23 And the scripture was fulfilled, saying: Abraham believed God, and it was reputed to him to justice, and he was called the friend of God.

24 Do you see that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only?

25 And in like manner also Rahab the harlot, was not she justified by works, receiving the messengers and sending them out another way?

26 For even as the body without the spirit is dead: so also faith without works is dead.

It is possible to create a kind of code language in which you declare that first, there is salvation, and then there are fruits of the salvation, and the fruits of the salvation are good works. We certainly can agree that, speculatively speaking, God, Who is outside of time, knows His elect and so His grace enables all good works, and frustrates the bad works that do not come from the operation of the free will. But this is an innatural reading of the entire Gospel, because the Gospel is written not from the eternal view of God but from the practical view of man. In that view, works are not predicated on the elect status, which is unknowable, but on the operation of the free will toward sainthood.

Man can reject the grace or he can cooperate with it. When he does, there is the fruit, and Christ promised to view it favorably. When he does not, there is sin, and then the judgement of Christ will weigh the sin against the faith. Despite the natural interest, even in the Gospel, to describe the dramatic and the unusual, there are clear passages that point to the gradual character of Christian faith: St. Peter walks on water the distance proportionate to his faith, the Apostles attempt and fail to heal the sick; St. Thomas and, repeatedly, St.Peter have lapses of faith; St. Paul dwells on the imperfections of his faith.

I put together a collection of verses, primarily from the Epistles, that point to this gradual buildup of faith, possible through grace, which is accomplished through works. But before I make the quotes, let me mention that th eissue is a bit like discovering a name of a continent on a map, which is spaced across the names of many geographical features and is diffucult to find only because the mental focus is on smaller print. If one is to summarize the pragmatic content of the Gospel in one word, that would be Christ's moral teaching, which is all about what to do and what not to do -- about works

***

Eph 2

8 For by grace you are saved through faith: and that not of yourselves, for it is the gift of God.

9 Not of works, that no man may glory.

10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus in good works, which God hath prepared that we should walk in them.

Eph 4

12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the word of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:

13 Until we all meet into the unity of faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the age of the fulness of Christ:

I Cor 4

11 Even unto this hour we both hunger and thirst and are naked and are buffeted and have no fixed abode.

12 And we labour, working with our own hands. We are reviled: and we bless. We are persecuted: and we suffer it.

13 We are blasphemed: and we entreat. We are made as the refuse of this world, the offscouring of all, even until now.

I Cor 15

58 Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye steadfast and unmoveable: always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your labour is not in vain in the Lord

II Cor 4

9 We suffer persecution: but are not forsaken. We are cast down: but we perish not.

10 Always bearing about in our body the mortification of Jesus, that the life also of Jesus may be made manifest in our bodies.

And then, of course, direct and clear references to the necessity of good works:

Mt. 16

27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels: and then will he render to every man according to his works.

Phil 2

12 Wherefore, my dearly beloved, (as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only but much more now in my absence) with fear and trembling work out your salvation.

13 For it is God who worketh in you, both to will and to accomplish, according to his good will.

***
With fear and trembling work out your salvation.

St. Francis had a friend, who was overcome with worry. His worry was, -- Am I saved? St. Francis, upon learning of his friend's anguish, said: -- You are saved. Now, go do something about it.

Amen

19 posted on 08/28/2005 2:58:28 AM PDT by annalex
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To: annalex

Now it's my turn to say I'm pulling something together.

May take a day or two.


(PS - Greatly enjoying this line of discussion)


20 posted on 08/29/2005 1:10:36 PM PDT by PetroniusMaximus
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To: annalex

***Well, the faith is the key. The Catholic teaching is that works without faith is vanity; at the same time, faith without works is dead:***



Do you believe you enter into a right relationship with God though works or by faith?


21 posted on 08/29/2005 11:08:52 PM PDT by PetroniusMaximus
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