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To: Frumanchu; P-Marlowe; Buggman; Alamo-Girl

see #354

While it is true that you say that it pleased Him, I have suggested a logical order based on the distinction between knowledge and decision.

This is no different than suggesting logical orders for either infra or supra lapsarianism.

It is simply illogical that God made decisions without knowledge, GIVEN that God is omniscient. IT is not possible that He did not know those who would believe.

Knowing that they believed, it was not possible that He would not accept them according to his decision and promises.

Knowledge will always precede decision. Otherwise there is a period of no knowledge, and therefore, we are contemplating less than an omniscient God.


355 posted on 08/03/2005 5:22:19 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It!)
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To: xzins
It is simply illogical that God made decisions without knowledge, GIVEN that God is omniscient. IT is not possible that He did not know those who would believe.

I recognize the need to establish a logical order, and it is somewhat similar to the infra/supra distinction. However you are drawing false conclusions from it.

In order to choose something (or someone) it is necessary to have knowledge of that which is being chosen from. I cannot choose to have vanilla ice cream without first knowing that it's an available option. Likewise, God must first have knowledge (in this case, foreknowledge) of an individual's existence (which of course necessarily implies a prior decision to create) before He could choose that individual.

HOWEVER, you are proceeding further in stating that it is a particular aspect of the knowledge of that individual (specifically, the foreknowledge of faith at some point in that individual's life) which leads Him to choose that individual.

When you say that "it is not possible that He did not know who would believe" in the way you are presenting it completely undermines the validity of needing to establish a logical order since you are essentially insisting foreknowledge of faith must necessarily precede all other decisions by God in the logical order. That's the only way you could say that there was not a point (logically) where God did now know who would believe.

To apply your position consistently, I could say that it is not possible that He did not know that those who would believe were those whom He had chosen to bring efficaciously to faith in Christ. Thus election was according to foreseen faith which faith He sovereignly brought about.

369 posted on 08/03/2005 5:55:14 AM PDT by Frumanchu (Saved by grace alone through faith alone in Christ alone to the glory of God alone.)
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