Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: Graves
Orthodox Christians regard the Council in Trullo as a continuation of the Fifth Ecumenical Council, for which reason it is also called the Quinisext Council. For Orthodox Christians, therefore, the Council in Trullo is God inspired and not open to question.

In 692 the Greek bishops, even by Orthodox standards, did not have the right to speak for the whole Church. Nor can you claim that it was a continuation of the Fifth and Sixth Ecumenical Councils. The Fifth Ecumenical Council (the Second Council of Constantinople) ended in 553. The Sixth Ecumenical Council (the Third Council of Constantinople) ended in 681. No western bishops were invited to the Council in Trullo in 692 nor was it approved by the pope or papal legates; it was clearly a local Greek affair. By your own concept of reception the Council in Trullo must be rejected as ecumenical because it was never received or accepted by the West. Or are you now positing that only reception by the Greeks is necessary: Ubi episcopi Graeci ibi Ecclesia?

My point is simply that Canon 32 is clear evidence of the liturgical Tradition of the Church and it provides implicit evidence as to the non-employment of azymes in the liturgy.

Even if I were to accept the ecumenical status of Trullo, nothing in the canons that you quoted gives any evidence on the nature of the bread that was used; on this point the canons are silent.

343 posted on 07/18/2005 6:09:44 AM PDT by Petrosius
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 322 | View Replies ]


To: Petrosius

"Even if I were to accept the ecumenical status of Trullo, nothing in the canons that you quoted gives any evidence on the nature of the bread that was used; on this point the canons are silent."
The evidence is implicit in Canon 32. Note that the canon tells us that the Liturgy was given to St. James complete with directions, i.e. what we would call rubrics. These would surely have included not just the matter of mixing water with the wine, but other important details, e.g. what sort of bread could be used.
Note also that the Liturgy of St. James is seen as the root liturgy. All other liturgies of the Church, according to Canon 32, are derived from the Liturgy of St. James. Thus, the Liturgy of St. Mark in Alexandria is from the Liturgy of St. Peter in Rome which was from the Liturgy of St. James. How do we know? Tradition tells us that St. Mark the Evangelist helped St. Peter in his ministry to the people in Rome.
The Liturgy of St. Basil came from the Liturgy of St. Peter the Holy Apostle as celebrated in Antioch which came from that of St. James. The Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom came from St. Basil's.
All over the Church, the various liturgies used have their origin in the Liturgy of St. James. And yet, as Agrarian noted in one of his posts, nowhere in the East, except in Armenia, do we detect the use of azymes.
That's a clue. Now apply the Vincentian Canon to the evidence and the only conclusion possible, it seems to me, is that azymes were not originally employed in Rome or in Armenia.


347 posted on 07/18/2005 7:45:23 AM PDT by Graves (Orthodoxy or death!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 343 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson