Posted on 03/19/2005 8:30:26 AM PST by sionnsar
John 2:1-12
One does not have to venture far into the Anglican blogosphere to recognize that the dominant discussion is on the House of Bishops’ report. This morning, I was led to turn my eyes to Mary rather than the bishops.
At the wedding in Cana, Mary comes to Jesus, who had not yet performed any public miracles, with a problem–"They have no wine.” She has a childlike trust that Jesus will do something about it–"Do whatever he tells you.” The scripture doesn’t tell us what she did next. I’ve always thought she went back to the party, but I have nothing to base that on except that there is no record of her helping the servants fill the purification jars.
We have a problem in the Anglican church. I think we are being called to a childlike trust that Jesus will do something about it, that the purification jars will be filled, that the wine will be deemed good by the master of the feast, and that Jesus’s glory will be manifest.
Each of the six purification jars held 20 or 30 gallons. It took time and hard labor for the servants to haul that much water from a bucket well. Some of us will be called to be those servants–"Do whatever he tells you.”
All of us will need to be patient but quietly expectant while the purification jars are being filled. The end result? It will be surprisingly good in quality and overabundant in quantity.
Let us be like Mary.
She was, you are, I am.
As for where she is right now... Standing with the multitudes, praising God for her salvation.
I need to correct something else, also. It is a THEOCRACY, not a monarchy. It is God rule, and Mary ain't God.
I need to correct something else, also. It is a THEOCRACY, not a monarchy. It is God rule, and Mary ain't God.
"For God is at work in you. FOR GOD IS AT WORK IN YOU!!!!!
Isn't that what I said? That the Spirit is working in you?"
And why did you not comment on the first part of my Scriptural citation? The part about "Work out your salvation..."?
It isn't either/or. WE DO HAVE FREE WILL. I can choose to work with God, or ignore Him. That's free will.
Regards
Matthew 22:31-32.
Before you believed in Christ, did you have that same option? No free will.
And I didn't leave out the first part, but the second part explains the first part and you ignored that.
It clearly says to work out your salvation with the Spirit working in you. You can't do it without the Spirit. The Spirit is at work in you so that yyou can do goos works.
And Jesus said to pray to them?????????
"Please note: All of the people Paul asked to pray for him were ALIVE."
Read the beautiful ending of Romans Chapter 8. Death will NOT separate us from God's love. Because our physical bodies have died doesn't follow that we are dead. God is the God of the Living, as God Himself says in Scripture.
Where does the Bible say that death separates us from the Body of Christ???
Regards
You said not to ask for their prayers because they're dead. Jesus said you're wrong; they're not dead.
So what's your next reason?
I am asking for Biblical references to pray to them. Ain't none.
It doesn't, it separates us from each other. Ain't no dead person gonna save you, stop praying to them.
"You are correct in what you say about the Church, I just suggest you look at the word of God and see if "the Church" means what you think it does."
Agreed. That is why I think it is important to look at the Early Church Fathers and what they thought about the Scripture - they were in the best position to interpret it. And we see that intercessary prayers to the "dead" was a belief of our Jewish heritage since BEFORE Jesus of Nazareth. Christianity continued this belief that those who have passed out of this life are in even a better position to pray for us. "the prayer of a righteous man is powerful." James. Those in heaven are truly made righteous by Christ. If they are now Christ-like, they are the "cloud of witnesses" that cheer us on all the more to share heaven with them. We are not separated from the Body of Christ because of death.
Regards
Don't need none. They ain't dead, Bible says so. Christians ask each other to pray for them, Bible says so. Christians don't need Biblical references for everything they do, Bible says so (2 Thess 2:15).
There you go again, calling Jesus a liar.
Prove it.
"Before you believed in Christ, did you have that same option? No free will."
I don't understand where you are going there. I had free will before I believed in Christ.
" And I didn't leave out the first part, but the second part explains the first part and you ignored that."
Really? Why did I quote it, then? You are stuck on this Either/or. Either God does it all, or man does it all. Paul is clear that we need God to do anything of value, yet, we also need to run the race and perservere in God's grace. God does not force us kicking and screaming into heaven. That's not how love works. God desires our love, and thus, there MUST be free will from us.
Regards
So, next time you hear from Paul, tell him I said "Hi".
"As for where she is right now... Standing with the multitudes, praising God for her salvation."
Of course. she says this in Luke 1 quite clearly. "my sould magnifies the Lord".
Regards
I will put my trust in the God who chose me, you put your trust in the God you choose. Bye.
"I am asking for Biblical references to pray to them. Ain't none."
You are missing Campion's point. The same verses that Paul uses for Christians to pray for others and himself apply to those in heaven. They are still part of the Body of Christ. Read Romans 8 again...
Regards
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