[St.Chuck]

When the mass, and the other sacraments were attacked and changed their efficacy was reduced, and so was the supply of grace to the world.

Interesting perspective. Attacked huh? Reduced efficacy? How many NO masses do you think it would take to equal one TLM, in terms of efficacy?

[murphE]

Don't know exactly, but look at the results. Many of them may be so insulting to Our Lord, and the disposition of those assisting so bad that even though they could be valid there is very little if any grace. A satanic mass can be valid, but do you think it imparts any grace? I imagine that the amount of grace is probably a reverse correlation to how "people centered" or horizontal the mass is, but I didn't mean to suggest I had an exact formula. If vocations have decreased 90% does that mean there is 90% less grace? Who knows.

Think of the Israelites, when they chose to stray from worship of God in the way He desired, He withdrew His protection from them, like saying, "you want to have things your way instead of mine go ahead". He allowed them to be conquered by pagan people, He allowed them to suffer because of their own choices. That's what is happening now. Just look at all the statistics. Why is it that the most faithful dioceses have higher numbers of vocations than less faithful dioceses, within the same country? It cannot be due to the effects of the culture because those effects are the same for both.

He's not going to force Himself on us. He'll let us have our own way, but that has consequences, denial of grace.