Posted on 11/22/2004 11:12:20 AM PST by stuartcr
I read the Book of Job this weekend, and I have a question regarding the reasoning behind Job's trials. I believe that God is all-powerful and all-knowing, which includes knowing what we are going to do. Going on this premise, my question is why did God, knowing the outcome, subject Job to all that he went through? Why did He allow satan to do the things he did to Job? The only thing I can think of, was to prove a point to Job?
Satan exists precisely because God gave all His creatures free will and He does not force them to behave in any way. They are FREE to choose not to follow God's laws, that is, to become like Satan.
He let Satan test Job partly to let Satan know Job was just, and partly to let Job know who He is, and what he, Job, was capable of.
I didn't see the movie, but since God knows what our free-will decision is going to be, how can it truly be free-will? God controls/creates all that happens. We may feel that what we do is a decision, but it is already known, along with all that happens as a result. To me, it seems like the outcome to everything is known, not to us, but to Him that made it all happen. It seems that everything happens just as it should.
Job 15:1-6 And Eliphaz the Temanite answered and said, Should a wise man answer with windy knowledge, and fill his belly with the east wind, Reasoning with unprofitable talk, and with speeches which do no good? Yea, thou makest piety of none effect, and restrainest meditation before *God. For thy mouth uttereth thine iniquity, and thou hast chosen the tongue of the crafty. Thine own mouth condemneth thee, and not I; and thy lips testify against thee.
Job’s three friends are the modern arminian movment. Same reasoning. Same outrage. Same ‘common sense’ lies. The Book of Job is the classic book of free willers versus the truth. Free will pastors and teachers and apologists will point to Job’s three friends as speaking wisdom. Yet God says of the speech of Job’s three friends:
Job 42:7,8 And it came to pass after Jehovah had spoken these words to Job, that Jehovah said to Eliphaz the Temanite, Mine anger is kindled against thee, and against thy two friends; for ye have not spoken rightly of me, like my servant Job. And now, take for yourselves seven bullocks and seven rams, and go to my servant Job, and offer up for yourselves a burnt-offering; and my servant Job shall pray for you, for him will I accept: lest I deal with you after your folly, for ye have not spoken of me rightly, like my servant Job.
Read what supposed compliments and truths Job’s three friends gave to God AS A REPROOF to Job to ‘repent’—in the middle of attacking Job, they do so with false compliments to God—and at the end of the Book it is very plain God is having none of it nor accepts what they have said. They only used their own notions/lies of positive emotions/flattery in God’s direction to validate ‘how’ to do their false religion as if it were not false. Their lie against Job is that he has done religon incorrectly--and that is 'why' evil came/is here. No doubt they were genuinely shocked at the end. But their mere shock did not excuse them and God’s prayer for them through Job and the sacrifice Job performed (the perfect for the imperfect—a pre-figuring of the cross of Christ…) was necessary for them to be pardoned. Job is a priest/intercessor for his own family in the beginning and one for his friends in the end. Hope this helps.
Job 1:4,5 And his sons went and made a feast in the house of each one on his day; and they sent and invited their three sisters to eat and to drink with them. And it was so, when the days of the feasting were gone about, that Job sent and hallowed them; and he rose up early in the morning, and offered up burnt-offerings according to the number of them all; for Job said, It may be that my children have sinned, and cursed God in their hearts. Thus did Job continually.
In the Name of Jesus Christ, Amen
I don't understand...discipline for what, being the way He made us, and our actions, and the consequences of those actions?
Thank you.
Why would God be vindicated for something that He knows we are going to do, and obviously allowed to do?
You are correct, we don't have all the answers, and it is a matter of having faith and trusting God. That is why I don't understand why there is such a conflict between different religions. People have faith, and trust in God. God created us all, with our differing beliefs/faiths, knowing the results of these faiths. It seems obvious that, it really doesn't matter to Him, as He made us that way.
Tell Gamecock, as he doesn't believe that satan knows, that is the reason for my reply.
I don't understand why the punishment, as satan is only doing as he was knowingly created to do.
Of course He does.
I should think that fairly obvious from my prefacing remarks... Just because He said something doesn't mean it's been demonstrated. It's easy to be a Marxist on an American University Campus. It's a bit more difficult in Gdansk, Poland.
No, because you are not the Creator of everything that has been, is, and will be.
Do you think it matters who/what we worship?
"I believe that God is all-powerful and all-knowing, which includes knowing what we are going to do."
Which includes also knowning what he is going to do.
Let there be light.
And God saw that light was good.
Hey, look, light is good!
The OT is just myths and fables.
If God is the creator of all that exists, why isn't He also the creator of our behavior?
I guess that's just the way God made us....some good, some bad.
If I take a time machine into tomorrow and see that you wore a white shirt, did I take away your free will?
While I don't believe God forces us to act in any particular way, I believe that He created us to act the way we do, mainly because He created us, and He knows how we will act. How is someone free to act, when their act, and the results of their actions, is already known?
I don't understand.
No, because I believe that whatever happens, is the way it's supposed to happen....just as God designed it.
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