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To: xzins
The point is whether it is a metaphorical or literal proposition that infants "speak lies." Since infants don't speak, then they don't speak lies. Speaking = verbalizing. It's a metaphor, OP. Probably we'll disagree and this isn't worth carrying forward for me...the capabilities of infants are just too obvious, so the intent of the verse is too obvious.

No, "speaking" does not always equal "verbalizing". The great majority of all human communication is non-verbal.

Beyond which, if it's a "metaphor", then what is the meaning of the metaphor but simply this:

What other "metaphorical" meaning can you deliberately and artificially shoe-horn into the verse, without destroying the teaching thereof about infants?

Remember, the Verse is about the morality of Infants. Does it "metaphorically" describe the morality of Infants as SINFUL, or INNOCENT? Well, which is it, Xzins?

It's a simple question, and I want a straight answer.

20 posted on 10/15/2004 6:57:23 AM PDT by OrthodoxPresbyterian (We are Unworthy Servants; We have only done Our Duty)
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To: OrthodoxPresbyterian

It means they're born with a tendency to sin early....we know also via the New Testament that they have a sin nature.

These next few stanzas of the psalm are also full of simile and metaphor. Am I to assume this is a psalm against wicked lions with fangs?




To the Chief Musician. Set to "Do Not Destroy." A Michtam of David.
1 [1] Do you indeed speak righteousness, you silent ones?
Do you judge uprightly, you sons of men?
2No, in heart you work wickedness;
You weigh out the violence of your hands in the earth.


3The wicked are estranged from the womb;
They go astray as soon as they are born, speaking lies.
4Their poison is like the poison of a serpent;
They are like the deaf cobra that stops its ear,
5Which will not heed the voice of charmers,
Charming ever so skillfully.


6Break their teeth in their mouth, O God!
Break out the fangs of the young lions, O LORD!
7Let them flow away as waters which run continually;
When he bends his bow,
Let his arrows be as if cut in pieces.
8Let them be like a snail which melts away as it goes,
Like a stillborn child of a woman, that they may not see the sun.


22 posted on 10/15/2004 7:09:43 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army and Proudly Supporting BUSH/CHENEY 2004!)
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