Kosta, at least those of us who grew up with old Orthodox relatives around, people from the old country, have all heard these stories. Of course the Church was wrong. I certainly have no problem saying that. Perhaps I haven't been following this thread well enough. Was someone denying that the Church acted inappropriately regarding women and natural functions in the past?
Kolokotronis wrote: "Kosta, at least those of us who grew up with old Orthodox relatives around, people from the old country, have all heard these stories. Of course the Church was wrong. I certainly have no problem saying that. Perhaps I haven't been following this thread well enough. Was someone denying that the Church acted inappropriately regarding women and natural functions in the past?"
What I am going to ask could sound like a snide comment from the peanut gallery, but it isn't. It's a real question, one to which there isn't a snappy answer. One that ought to make us pause and think.
We have been reading here in part about the hard minded practices of the old Russian Orthodox Church concerning women and their periods and attendance in Church. And we are just about to put all of that to bed as bad old superstition.
But then query: in the Torah, God lays out rules just as specific and of a very similar nature concerning female spiritual impurity at the time of their monthly cycle. They were not to partake in sacrifice, they were not to touch sacred things, etc., etc. That's in the Bible itself in black and white. So, when God imposed those rules, that was not divine, but when the Russian Orthodox imposed the same rules, it was superstitious tradition? Is that the truth? Or is it more true to say that some of the ancient Jewish superstitious traditions about the female cycle crept into the Bible, in the same way that traditions concerning the divorce of wives appear in the Bible, but Jesus says that they never came from God?
Kolokotronis wrote: "Kosta, at least those of us who grew up with old Orthodox relatives around, people from the old country, have all heard these stories. Of course the Church was wrong. I certainly have no problem saying that. Perhaps I haven't been following this thread well enough. Was someone denying that the Church acted inappropriately regarding women and natural functions in the past?"
What I am going to ask could sound like a snide comment from the peanut gallery, but it isn't. It's a real question, one to which there isn't a snappy answer. One that ought to make us pause and think.
We have been reading here in part about the hard minded practices of the old Russian Orthodox Church concerning women and their periods and attendance in Church. And we are just about to put all of that to bed as bad old superstition.
But then query: in the Torah, God lays out rules just as specific and of a very similar nature concerning female spiritual impurity at the time of their monthly cycle. They were not to partake in sacrifice, they were not to touch sacred things, etc., etc. That's in the Bible itself in black and white. So, when God imposed those rules, that was not divine, but when the Russian Orthodox imposed the same rules, it was superstitious tradition? Is that the truth? Or is it more true to say that some of the ancient Jewish superstitious traditions about the female cycle crept into the Bible, in the same way that traditions concerning the divorce of wives appear in the Bible, but Jesus says that they never came from God?
Kolokotronis, I grew up with Orthodox relatives and we never talked about this. The Church was not to judge, not to serve as a policeman, but to be a loving guide.
The whole Serbian Kosovo love-affair is based on the Orthodox mindset of the Serbs: when faced with the choice to either bow to the Sultan and embrace Islam, or to choose Heavenly Kingdom, Serbian Prince Lazar and his knights chose the Kingdom of God because, as he said the earthly kingdoms are temporary and that of God is ever lasting.
When in march of this year, Kosovo Albanians torched Serb houses, the inhabitants left everything behind but took the icons and the candillas; nothing else mattered to them.
The Church that prosecutes women because of their period is alien to me. Tolstoy's famous story "The Three Hermits" is what Orthodoxy of my youth is, although it was written in the late 1800's. So, when you tell me that you knew about medieval Russian Church's puritanical ways, this is news to me because we have no moral leg to stand on and criticize Catholics and Protestants for similar transgressions.
My point was that sometimes Orthodoxy is portrayed as holier than Grail. Orthodoxy keeps theology unchanged, but the rest is a different story.
The Church should teach us what Jesus taught. It should stay out of people's bedrooms. Birth control is birth control no matter what method is used. If that is immoral, then preventive medicine is immoral too.
Well, in part, but also your comment that Orthodoxy understands human nature. I really don't think so. History proves that it doesn't. It's not in its domain. I wish the Church would stay where it belongs -- which is toteahc us how to be better human beings instead of judging and punishing people for their nature.