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To: ultima ratio
Only ex cathedra statements on faith and morals are universally binding--and they are never novelties.

I just love watching you and the Modernists march in goose step regards ex cathedra statements. Every new church catechechism class I have attended says exactly that,then the "facilitators" cite the Immaculate Conception and the Assumption as the two examples of the only ex cathedra pronouncements in recent history.

Using your argumentation,how can you defend "Qua Primum",the Tridentine Mass can hardly be defended as having sprung from directly from scripture or the early Church fathers,can it?

241 posted on 07/09/2004 9:29:22 PM PDT by saradippity
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To: saradippity; ultima ratio

correction:knock out the first from in the last sentence.


242 posted on 07/09/2004 9:33:10 PM PDT by saradippity
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To: saradippity

I said nothing about specific dogmas. I said only that any defined doctrines must be ex cathedra and cannot be novelties.

1. Ex cathedra is simply a theological term that means an authoritative teaching from the Chair of Peter. It is specifically a MAGISTERIAL teaching. Here is what the First Vatican Council, Sess. IV, Const. de Ecclesiâ Christi, canon iv, stated:

"We teach and define that it is a dogma Divinely revealed that the Roman pontiff when he speaks ex cathedra, that is when in discharge of the office of pastor and doctor of all Christians, by virtue of his supreme Apostolic authority, he defines a doctrine regarding faith or morals to be held by the universal Church, by the Divine assistance promised to him in Blessed Peter, is possessed of that infallibility with which the Divine Redeemer willed that his Church should be endowed in defining doctrine regarding faith or morals, and that therefore such definitions of the Roman pontiff are of themselves and not from the consent of the Church irreformable."

2. They cannot be novelties because the First Vatican Council excluded these from the doctrine of infallibity, canon iii:

"For the Holy Spirit was not promised to the Successors of Peter that by His revelation they might disclose new doctrine, but that by His help they might guard the revelation transmitted through the apostles and the deposit of faith."

The gift of infallibility therefore pertains only to what has been transmitted through the apostles and the deposit of faith, not some new doctrine never before considered in the past by the Church.

That is all I said. As for Quo Primum--Pius V was not declaring any doctrine, he was imposing a discipline on the universal Church--a discipline, by the way, which has never been officially abrogated. It is a papal bull that has nothing to do with any ex cathedra definitions.


243 posted on 07/10/2004 5:22:57 AM PDT by ultima ratio
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