AG , this is not about searching the scripture to confirm some secret personal revelation . This is clearly speaking to the Bereans searching the Jewish Canon for evidence that the Gospel being presented to them by the disciples was indeed prophesied.
However, again I aver the Bible is inerrant and reveals God truly, but not fully. Here is the difference as explained by Christ (emphasis mine): And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.
And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. – John 5:37-39
This is not about personal revelation AG it is about their inability to hear or see the evidence of Christ through the clear witness sent by God
John 5:37,38
The testimony of the Father was given in three forms: (1) By direct or audible voice and the visible sending of the Spirit--as at Jesus' baptism. (2) By revelations, through the medium of prophets and angels gathered and preserved in the Old Testament Scriptures. (3) Through the Son and his works.
Jesus here asserts that all testimony of the first kind had failed to reach the Jewish rulers; the testimony of the second kind has been utterly lost upon them, for they failed to see its accordance with the testimony of the third kind which he was even then exhibiting to them, neither had it taught them to expect a personal Savior
McGarvey and Pendleton
We already know from the Scriptures themselves that some things which could have been written therein have been withheld from us according to God’s will:
And when the seven thunders had uttered their voices, I was about to write: and I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Seal up those things which the seven thunders uttered, and write them not. – Revelation 10:4
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, [even] to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. – Daniel 12:4
This again is not saying that there is any further personal revelation..you are reading things into the word to defend your position
What was with held and why ?
Most agree that what was withheld was a sight so terrible that believers could become fearful instead of hopeful, not some personal secret revelation
Aleph reads, "Whatsoever things." But most manuscripts support English Version. uttered their voices--A, B, C, and Aleph omit "their voices." Then translate, "had spoken." unto me--omitted by A, B, C, Aleph, and Syriac. Seal up--the opposite command to Revelation 22:20. Even though at the time of the end the things sealed in Daniel's time were to be revealed, yet not so the voices of these thunders. Though heard by John, they were not to be imparted by him to others in this book of Revelation; so terrible are they that God in mercy withholds them, since "sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof." The godly are thus kept from morbid ponderings over the evil to come; and the ungodly are not driven by despair into utter recklessness of life. ALFORD adds another aim in concealing them, namely, "godly fear, seeing that the arrows of God's quiver are not exhausted." Besides the terrors foretold, there are others unutterable and more horrifying lying in the background.
Gill
This is the disciple which testifieth of these things, and wrote these things: and we know that his testimony is true. And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen. – John 21:24-25
For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known. – 1 Corinthians 13:12
The reason for this goes back to Jesus’ explanation above (John 5) --- which is to say, we must rely on the indwelling Holy Spirit for understanding, because the natural man cannot receive it:
We can agree that the natural man can not receive THE GOSPEL , we are told it is foolishness to him.But neither of these scriptures that you have chosen to link together (even though they actually cover different topics ) in any way hint that there is any further personal revelation that will come short of the time we stand in Glory and see Him face to face.
On John 21 Gill observes
Verse 25. And there are also many other things which Jesus did,.... Which refer not to his doctrines and discourses, his sermons and prayers, and the conversation he had with his disciples, and others, on different accounts; but to the signs, and wonders, and miraculous operations, which were done by him, that are neither recorded in this, nor in any of the evangelists:
the which, if they should be written everyone; with all the particular circumstances relating to them:
I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. The Arabic version renders it, "the things written in the books"; and the Syriac, "that the world would not be sufficient for the books that should be written"; and so the Persic, which adds, "and the Scribes of the world would fail, or be deficient"; there would not be Scribes enough in the world to write them; nor could they be read by men, if they were written; the world would be overloaded with them; and therefore the Holy Ghost has not thought fit to lay such a burden on men they could not bear, as to read such numbers of volumes; but has reduced them into a brief compendium, which may be read with ease, delight, and pleasure; and which is abundantly sufficient to attest the truth of Christ's incarnation, miracles, doctrines, obedience, sufferings, death, resurrection, ascension, session at God's right hand, &c. and of the whole of Christianity, and all that appertains to it, or whatever is necessary to be known, for the salvation of men
On Corthinians 13 Johnson notes
11-13. When I was a child. In these verses the change he has declared will take place is illustrated by the change from childhood to manhood. The speech, thoughts and feelings of the child give way to those of the man. So it will be when the church moves on from childhood to full development.
12. For now we see in a glass. In a "mirror." The mirrors of the ancients were of polished metal, and were far inferior to ours. The images were indistinct in comparison. They were seen darkly, indistinctly, imperfectly. Thus in this state of our knowledge of divine things imperfect and incomplete. But then face to face. We will not look in a glass in the coming state, but will see face to face, without a veil, or obscurity. Now I know in part. There were limitations upon the knowledge even of Paul; only a part was seen. But then, when the veil is taken away, and the full revelation has come in the presence of Christ, he shall know fully, know God, eternity and its secrets, even as he is known to God. Thus it is shown that all these spiritual gifts are fleeting.
It is an interesting observation that this chapter actually says that the spiritual gifts of the early church will disappear , that what will remain is faith ,hope and charity
But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him. But God hath revealed [them] unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know [them], because they are spiritually discerned. But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man. For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ. – 1 Corinthians 2:9-16
AG do you know what Gnosticism is ?
The root word for gnosticism is the Greek verb ginosko (ginoskw)[3] which simply means “to know.” In and of itself the word is neutral. What gnosticism has become to mean, however, is “secret knowledge.” The Gnostics of early Christianity claimed to have secret revelations that were not in the pages of Scripture and consequently when the term gnosticism is used today, it is in direct reference to extra-Biblical “revelation” or teaching that cannot be confirmed by the Bible or other sources.[4]
“But if he does not listen, take one or two more along with you, so that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every spoken word may be confirmed” (Mattityahu/Matthew 18:16).
“This is the third time I am coming to you. Every fact is to be sustained by the evidence of two or three witnesses” (2 Corinthians 13:1; cf. Yochanan/John 8:17; 1 Timotheos/Timothy 5:19; Ivrim/Hebrews 10:28.).
A key to understanding gnosticism are the admonitions of the New Testament. In Mattityahu/Matthew 18:16, Yeshua tells us “by the mouth of two or three witnesses every spoken word may be confirmed.” The Apostle Paul also reiterates this in 2 Corinthians 13:1. Something can only be truth or fact with the appropriate confirmations.
“By the testimony of two witnesses or three witnesses shall the condemned person be put to death; he shall not be put to death by the testimony of a single witness” (Devarim/Deuteronomy 17:6).
“A single witness shall not stand up against any man for any iniquity or for any error, regarding any sin that he may commit; according to two witnesses or according to three witnesses shall a matter be confirmed” (Devarim/Deuteronomy 19:15).
Both Devarim/Deuteronomy 17:6 and 19:15 tell us that sufficient witnesses or evidences are needed to put a person to death. “On the evidence of two or three witnesses a matter shall be confirmed.” In other words, if you have no substantial proof, you do not have a case.
TNN Online discusses many Bible prophecy related news events which require hard evidence. Yeshua Himself tells us that deception will be rampant in the Last Days. If we cannot provide legitimate documentation surrounding a particular phenomenon, then it cannot be treated as fact. This is the clear Scriptural admonition.
Unfortunately, we have encountered others who feel that they do not need to provide evidence surrounding current events. Obviously, someone does not need to footnote the fact that George Washington was the first president of the United States. But, if someone claims that Alexander Hamilton was really controlling things during the Washington Administration, then that would be different. A person would need to provide documented evidence in regard to Hamilton’s political career, writings, and recorded actions. Just saying “Hamilton really controlled things” is not enough.
What is gnosticism? In the First—Third Centuries it was a system of beliefs that ran contrary to Scripture that people claimed was “revealed” to them. Today, it predominantly means “secret knowledge” or information that only one person or a select group of individuals have. The Bible tells us that truth will be confirmed or proved by the evidence/witness of two or three. Yeshua tells us very clearly that we are to be on guard at all times and not be deceived. We must watch out for people claiming “hidden revelation,” that cannot be proven.
http://www.tnnonline.net/theonews/apologetics/her-blas-gn/
There is a very fine line between the illumination of the Holy Spirit on scripture as we read and the seeking and the belief in personal revelation that somehow completes the word of God . We must be very careful not to fall into that heresy
Is this not a devotion thread where many express their relationship with the Lord.
Come to these threads as you are; leave with what you have discovered.
Absolutely no flaming! These daily threads are intended to be devotional in nature. If a particular day's offering says nothing to you, please just go on and wait for the next day. Consider these threads a DMZ of sorts, a place where a perpetual truce is in effect and a place where all other arguments and disagreements from other times and places are left behind.
I can attest from personal experience that reading from Chambers daily will almost certainly change - not one's faith - but one's perspective of his/her own faith, and open up new vistas in your spiritual life. If - when - this happens to a reader of these threads, and they choose to share what has happened within them - we are treading on hallowed ground. Be respectful.
1 posted on 05/27/2004 8:14:23 AM EDT by Religion Moderator
Sadly, this thread has become contentious for me with the assertion of ‘gnosticism’ and contentiousness is not appropriate for a devotion. I shall respond to all of your issues on the other thread at post 20.