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To: topcat54
Second, baptism does not infuse grace into an infant.

Obviously, that is not our belief. You can hardly expect us to be consistent with beliefs of yours which we reject.

Third, Mary didn't need to be born in a state of gace, she simply needed to be "sanctified" at the moment of conception. That is what the angel declared.

No, the angel called Mary "kecharitomene" -- already completely graced. I believe the verb form refers to an action completed in the past.

63 posted on 05/03/2004 2:37:40 PM PDT by Campion
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To: Campion
"Second, baptism does not infuse grace into an infant."

Obviously, that is not our belief. You can hardly expect us to be consistent with beliefs of yours which we reject.

Huh?? That is precisely the RC position.

“The justification of which St. Paul here speaks is the infusion of sanctifying grace which alone renders a person supernaturally pleasing in the sight of God.” “But justification, that is, an infusion of sanctifying grace, cannot be merited by us; it is an entirely gratuitous gift of God.” (from the Douay Bible commentary on Romans 3 and 4)

And from the Catholic Encyclopedia on Justification:

The two elements of active justification, forgiveness of sin and sanctification, furnish at the same time the elements of habitual justification, freedom from sin and holiness. According to the Catholic doctrine, however, this freedom from sin and this sanctity are effected, not by two distinct and successive Divine acts, but by a single act of God. For, just as light dispels darkness, so the infusion of sanctifying grace eo ipso dispels from the soul original and mortal sin. (Cf. Trent, sess. VI, can. xi: "Si quis dixerit, homines justificari vel sola imputatione justitiae Christi, vel sola peccatorum remissione, exclusa gratia et caritate, quae in cordibus eorum per Spiritum Sanctum diffundatur atque illis inhaereat. . ., a.s.")

While in Baptism infants are forthwith cleansed of the stain of original sin without any preparation on their part, the adult must pass through a moral preparation, which consists essentially in turning from sin and towards God.

Someone needs a refresher course.
67 posted on 05/03/2004 2:59:40 PM PDT by topcat54
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