Posted on 03/15/2004 6:40:12 PM PST by narses
The "Bible Alone" is Not Enough
Answers to 25 Questions on the History of New Testament which completely refute the Protestants' "Bible Only" Theory.
ONE
Did Our Lord write any part of the New Testament or command His Apostles to do so? Our Lord Himself never wrote a line, nor is there any record that He ordered His Apostles to write; He did command them to teach and to preach. Also He to whom all power was given in Heaven and on earth (Matthew 28-18) promised to give them the Holy Ghost (John 14-26) and to be with them Himself till the end of the world. (Matthew 28-20).
Comment: If reading the Bible were a necessary means of salvation, Our Lord would have made that statement and also provided the necessary means for His followers.
TWO
How many of the Apostles or others actually wrote what is now in the New Testament? A few of the Apostles wrote part of Our Lords teachings, as they themselves expressly stated; i.e., Peter, Paul, James, John, Jude, Matthew, also Saints Mark and Luke. None of the others wrote anything, so far as is recorded.
Comment: If the Bible privately interpreted was to be a Divine rule of Faith, the Apostles would have been derelict in their duty when instead, some of them adopted preaching only.
Was it a teaching or a Bible-reading Church that Christ founded?
The Protestant Bible expressly states that Christ founded a teaching Church, which existed before any of the New Testament books were written.
Romans 10-17: So then faith cometh by Hearing and hearing by the word of God.
Matthew 28-19: Go ye therefore and Teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.
Mark 16-20: And they went forth, and Preached everywhere, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following.
Mark 16-15: And He said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and Preach the gospel to every creature.
Comment: Thus falls the entire basis of the 'Bible-only theory.
FOUR
Was there any drastic difference between what Our Lord commanded the Apostles to teach and what the New Testament contains? Our Lord commanded His Apostles to teach all things whatsoever He had commanded; (Matthew 28-20); His Church must necessarily teach everything; (John 14-26); however, the Protestant Bible itself teaches that the Bible does not contain all of Our Lords doctrines:
John 20-30: And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book.
John 21-25: And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written.
Comment: How would it have been possible for second century Christians to practice Our Lords religion, if private interpretation of an unavailable and only partial account of Christs teaching were indispensable?
Does the New Testament expressly refer to Christs "unwritten word"? The New Testament itself teaches that it does not contain all that Our Lord did or, consequently, all that He taught.
John 20-30: And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book.
John 21-25: And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written.
Comment: Since the Bible is incomplete, it needs something else to supplement it; i.e., the spoken or historically recorded word which we call Tradition.
SIX
What became of the unwritten truths which Our Lord and the Apostles taught? The Church had carefully conserved this 'word of mouth teaching by historical records called Tradition. Even the Protestant Bible teaches that many Christian truths were to be handed down by word of mouth.
2 Thessalonians 2-14: Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.
2 Timothy 2-2: And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also.
Comment: Hence not only Scripture but other sources of information must be consulted to get the whole of Christs teaching. Religions founded on 'the Bible only are therefore necessarily incomplete.
Between what years were the first and last books of the New Testament written? The first book, Saint Matthews Gospel, was not written until about ten years after Our Lords Ascension. Saint Johns fourth gospel and Apocalypse or Book of Revelations were not written until about 100 A.D.
Comment: Imagine how the present-day privately interpreted 'Bible-only theory would have appeared at a time when the books of the New Testament were not only unavailable, but most of them had not yet been written.
When was the New Testament placed under one cover? In 397 A.D. by the Council of Carthage, from which it follows that non- Catholics have derived their New Testament from the Catholic Church; no other source was available.
Comment: Up to 397 A.D., some of the Christians had access to part of the New Testament; into this situation, how would the 'Bible-only privately interpreted theory have fitted?
NINE
Why so much delay in compiling the New Testament? Prior to 397 A.D., the various books of the New Testament were not under one cover, but were in the custody of different groups or congregations. The persecutions against the Church, which had gained new intensity, prevented these New Testament books from being properly authenticated and placed under one cover. However, this important work was begun after Constantine gave peace to Christianity in 313 A.D., allowing it to be practiced in the Roman Empire.
Comment: This again shows how utterly impossible was the 'Bible-only theory, at least up to 400 A.D.
TEN
What other problem confronted those who wished to determine the contents of the New Testament? Before the inspired books were recognized as such, many other books had been written and by many were thought to be inspired; hence the Catholic Church made a thorough examination of the whole question; biblical scholars spent years in the Holy Land studying languages of New Testament writings.
Comment: According to the present-day 'Bible-only theory, in the above circumstances, it would also have been necessary for early Christians to read all the doubtful books and, by interior illumination, judge which were and which were not divinely inspired.
ELEVEN
Who finally did decide which books were inspired and therefore belonged to the New Testament? Shortly before 400 A.D. a General Council of the Catholic Church, using the infallible authority which Christ had given to His own Divine institution, finally decided which books really belonged to the New Testament and which did not.
Either the Church at this General Council was infallible, or it was not.
If the Church was infallible then, why is it not infallible now? If the Church was not infallible then, in that case the New Testament is not worth the paper it is written on, because internal evidences of authenticity and inspiration are inconclusive and because the work of this Council cannot now be rechecked; this is obvious from reply to next question.
Comment: In view of these historical facts, it is difficult to see how non-Catholics can deny that it was from the (Roman) Catholic Church that they received the New Testament.
TWELVE
Why is it impossible for modern non-Catholics to check over the work done by the Church previous to 400 A.D.? The original writings were on frail material called papyrus, which had but temporary enduring qualities. While the books judged to be inspired by the Catholic Church were carefully copied by her monks, those rejected at that time were allowed to disintegrate, for lack of further interest in them.
Comment: What then is left for non-Catholics, except to trust the Catholic Church to have acted under divine inspiration; if at that time, why not now?
THIRTEEN
Would the theory of private interpretation of the New Testament have been possible for the year 400 A.D.? No, because, as already stated, no New Testament as such was in existence.
Comment: If our non-Catholic brethren today had no Bibles, how could they even imagine following the 'Bible-only privately interpreted theory but before 400 A.D., New Testaments were altogether unavailable.
FOURTEEN
Would the private interpretation theory have been possible between 400 A.D., and 1440 A.D., when printing was invented? No, the cost of individual Bibles written by hand was prohibitive; moreover, due to the scarcity of books, and other reasons, the ability to read was limited to a small minority. The Church used art, drama and other means to convey Biblical messages.
Comment: To have proposed the 'Bible-only theory during the above period would obviously have been impracticable and irrational.
FIFTEEN
Who copied and conserved the Bible during the interval between 400 A.D. and 1440 A.D.? The Catholic monks; in many cases these monks spent their entire lives to give the world personally-penned copies of the Scriptures, before printing was invented.
Comment: In spite of this, the Catholic Church is accused of having tried to destroy the Bible; had she desired to do this, she had 1500 years within which to do so.
SIXTEEN
Who gave the Reformers the authority to change over from the one Faith, one Fold and one Shepherd program, to that of the 'Bible-only Theory? Saint Paul seems to answer the above when he said: 'But though we, or an angel from Heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. Galatians 1-8 (Protestant version).
Comment: If in 300 years, one-third of Christianity was split into at least 300 sects, how many sects would three-thirds of Christianity have produced in 1900 years? (Answer is 5700.)
SEVENTEEN
Since Luther, what consequences have followed from the use of the 'Bible-only theory and its personal interpretation? Just what Saint Paul foretold when he said: 'For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears. 2 Timothy 4-3 (Protestant edition). According to the World Almanac for 1953 there are in the United States 20 different organizations of Methodists, 22 kinds of Baptists, 10 branches of Presbyterians, 13 organizations of Mennonites, 18 of Lutherans and hundreds of other denominations.
Comment: The 'Bible-only theory may indeed cater to the self-exaltation of the individual, but it certainly does not conduce to the acquisition of Divine truth.
EIGHTEEN
In Christs system, what important part has the Bible? The Bible is one precious source of religious truth; other sources are historical records (Tradition) and the abiding presence of the Holy Ghost.
Comment: Elimination of any one of the three elements in the equation of Christs true Church would be fatal to its claims to be such.
NINETEEN
Now that the New Testament is complete and available, what insolvable problem remains? The impossibility of the Bible to explain itself and the consequent multiplicity of errors which individuals make by their theory of private interpretation. Hence it is indisputable that the Bible must have an authorized interpreter.
2 Peter 1-20: Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
2 Peter 3-16: As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
Acts 8-30: And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Isaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest? 31. And he said, How can I, except some men should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.
Comment: Only by going on the supposition that falsehood is as acceptable to God as is truth, can the 'Bible-only theory be defended.
TWENTY
Who is the official expounder of the Scriptures? The Holy Ghost, acting through and within the Church which Christ founded nineteen centuries ago; the Bible teaches through whom in the Church come the official interpretations of Gods law and Gods word.
Luke 10-16: He that heareth you heareth Me; and he that despiseth you despiseth Me; and he that despiseth Me despiseth Him that sent Me.
Matthew 16-18: And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
Malachias 2-7: For the priests lips should keep knowledge, and they should seek the law at his mouth: for he is the messenger of the Lord of hosts.
Comment: Formerly, at least, it was commonly held that when individuals read their Bibles carefully and prayerfully, the Holy Ghost would guide each individual to a knowledge of the truth. This is much more than the Catholic Church claims for even the Pope himself. Only after extended consultation and study, with much fervent prayer, does he rarely and solemnly make such a decision.
TWENTY-ONE
What are the effects of the Catholic use of the Bible? Regardless of what persons may think about the Catholic Church, they must admit that her system gets results in the way of unity of rule and unity of Faith; otherwise stated, one Faith, one Fold and one Shepherd.
Comment: If many millions of non-Catholics in all nations, by reading their Bible carefully and prayerfully, had exactly the same faith, reached the same conclusions, then this theory might deserve the serious consideration of intelligent, well-disposed persons -- but not otherwise.
TWENTY-TWO
Why are there so many non-Catholic Churches? Because there is so much different interpretation of the Bible; there is so much different interpretation of the Bible because there is so much wrong interpretation; there is so much wrong interpretation because the system of interpreting is radically wrong; you cannot have one Fold and one Shepherd, one Faith and one Baptism, by allowing every man and every woman to distort and pervert the Scriptures to suit his or her own pet theories.
Comment: To say that Bible reading is an intensely Christian practice, is to enunciate a beautiful truth; to say that Bible reading is the sole source of religious Faith, is to make a sadly erroneous statement.
TWENTY-THREE
Without Divine aid, could the Catholic Church have maintained her one Faith, one Fold, and one Shepherd? Not any more than the non-Catholic sects have done; they are a proof of what happens when, without Divine aid, groups strive to do the humanly impossible.
Comment: Catholics love, venerate, use the bible; but they also know that the Bible alone is not Christs system but only a precious book, a means, an aid by which the Church carries on her mission to 'preach the Gospel to every living creature and to keep on preaching it 'to the end of time.
TWENTY-FOUR
Were there any printed Bibles before Luther? When printing was invented, about 1440, one of the first, if not the earliest printed book, was an edition of the Catholic Bible printed by Johann Gutenberg. It is reliably maintained that 626 editions of the Catholic Bible, or portions thereof, had come from the press through the agency of the Church, in countries where her influence prevailed, before Luthers German version appeared in 1534. Of these, many were in various European languages. Hence Luthers 'discovery of the supposedly unknown Bible at Erfurt in 1503 is one of those strange, wild calumnies with which anti-Catholic literature abounds.
Comment: Today parts of the Bible are read in the vernacular from every Catholic altar every Sunday. The Church grants a spiritual premium or indulgence to those who read the Bible; every Catholic family has, or is supposed to have, a Bible in the home. Millions of Catholic Bibles are sold annually.
TWENTY-FIVE
During the Middle Ages, did the Catholic Church manifest hostility to the Bible as her adversaries claim? Under stress of special circumstances, various regulations were made by the Church to protect the people from being spiritually poisoned by the corrupted and distorted translations of the Bible; hence opposition to the Waldensians, Albigensians, Wycliffe and Tyndale.
Comment: Individual churchmen may at times have gone too far in their zeal, not to belittle the Bible, but to protect it. There is no human agency in which authority is always exercised blamelessly.
Taken from The Catholic Religion Proved by the Protestant Bible
Reprinted from the Juluy 1995 edition of
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I have not understood your posts very well, but I do understand conversion and the desire to serve the Lord Jesus Christ with heart, mind, soul, body, and strength. May you find the Lord's blessings every step of the way for he is the Way, the Truth and the Life.
Indeed. En arche...
Nice collection of antidoctal evidence, now do you have any actual Statistics?
To be honest however, let's run your list down.
WORCESTER, MA. A former pastor Andrew J. Bierkan, 54, at the First Congregational Church of Sutton who now heads a church in Ohio has been indicted here on charges of unnatural rape of a child and posing a child in a state of nudity. He is now pastor of St. Paul United Church of Christ in Cincinnati, according to Worcester District Attorney John J. Conte. (Worcester Telegram & Gazette, August 13, 2003) Ex-Sutton pastor charged with rape of girl from church
No evidence that the congregation or denomination covered up the crime.
MINNEAPOLIS, MN-An organization calling itself SNAP (Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests) will file a lawsuit against an Episcopal priest who abused a California youngster years ago, and still serves in a parish today. David Clohessy, 46, a national director of SNAP told VIRTUOSITY that he could not name the priest pending the suit, but would release the name shortly. Clohessy did express one serious concern. "I fear that some 400 ex-Roman Catholic priests will surface in other denominations including the Episcopal Church." (Aug. 2, 2003)
Are you certain that you want to cite THIS particular article?
Eddie Thomas, pastor of St. Luke Baptist Church in Ringgold, LA., is arrested and charged with indecent behavior with a juvenile, aggravated incest and pornography involving a juvenile. (the Shreveport Times, July 17, 2003) Police seize videotape alleged to show sex with child
Again, no evidence that the congregation or denomination covered this crime.
South Austrailia, AUS. A South Australian police task force into child sex abuse within the Anglican Church had identified 217 victims and 48 possible offenders, police said today. However the number of victims could rise to more than 400 as investigations continued, Police Commissioner Mal Hyde said. Mr Hyde today likened the scale of police investigations into child sex abuse to those for the infamous Snowtown bodies-in-the-barrels murders in 1999. (The Age, July 16 2003) Major sex abuse uncovered in Anglican Church
since i feel generous, i'll give you this one, however it should be noted that there is no statement whether or not the Church was aware of these crimes and/or covered up for the alleged offenders.
Vicar Rev Robin Everett of Castle Donnington, Leics, is convicted of indecently assaulting two young girls. (UK Telegraph, June 7, 2003) Vicar faces prison for sex assaults
No evidence of the Church covering up the crime of this man.
Lake Wales, FL. The pastor at the Church of the Nazarene has been charged with sexually assaulting a male 17-year-old youth leader three times in 2001. The Rev. Gene Francis, 52, of Lake Wales, was arrested Tuesday and charged with unlawful sexual activity with a minor. (Sarasota Herald-Tribune, June 4, 2003) Lake Wales minister arrested in sexual assault case
Again, no evidence that the church covered up this man's crimes.
Tuscon, AZ. The Rev. David Valencia, 47, assistant pastor of a Pentecostal church is expected in court Wednesday on rape charges issued by Pennsylvania authorities. In Pennsylvania, Valencia was an assistant pastor at Christ Church at Grove Farm, an interdenominational church that uses Anglican liturgy. The pastor of Christ Church, the Rev. John Guest, told the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette that Valencia was dismissed in late 2001 because he was found to have pornography on an office computer after he was warned about a similar incident months earlier. (Tucson Citizen, May 31, 2003) Rev. David Valencia allegedly had sex with a 17-year-old girl he was counseling
Note that Father Guest dismissed the offender. i know Father Guest, coming from the same area as his church is located in. Note that there is NO evidence that either Father Guest, or heirarchy of the man's present congregation attempted to cover up the man's crimes.
PORTLAND, OR. Church volunteer pleaded innocent to 26 counts of rape, sodomy and sex abuse. Derrick Mayberry was indicted by a grand jury on Tuesday and entered the plea on Wednesday. Mayberry, 23, was arrested May 15 on accusations of raping two teenage girls he met while volunteering at the New Beginnings Christian Center in northeast Portland. The victims were 13 and 15 years old. (KOIN TV, May 29, 2003) Church Worker, Coach Enters Plea In Sex Abuse Case Church volunteer, coach faces sex abuse charges
NOTE: not a clergyman. i would not hold any Catholic Diocese responsible for laymen either, since the controls are not as strict as for clergy, in spite of what the criminal or civil legal system may do.
Queensland, AUS. In the small town of Seymour, townspeople are shocked to learn that the late Anglican Fr. Sapsford molested dozens of alter boys while he was married with children, and after his serial molestation at another church was revealed in 1996. There are allegations by the parents of the victim boys that the Archbishop covered up the original allegations. The church is not compensating victims while they consult with legal counsel. Anglican Father Walliker says he is not shocked as he has seen this before in the Anglican Church. (ABC online, May 8, 2003) Cover-up left paedophile to prey on Vic altar boys
Pretty easy to accuse a dead guy of crimes when he is not around to defend himself. i would not hold this matter against a Catholic either.
NEWARK, N.J. A convicted sex offender who was named pastor of a city church several weeks ago has been removed from the post. Shiloh Baptist Church leaders had hired the Rev. Chavalis T. Williams in mid-March, even though they knew he had pleaded guilty in Florida to charges of child abuse and using children in a sexual performance. (Newsday, May 7, 2003) Convicted sex offender removed as pastor of Newark church
It sounds as if the Church corrected the problem, and note that there is no evidence that the man had abused anyone in the several weeks he pastored the church.
Unidentified clergyman in Norway defends himself by accusing boys of pestering him to provide pornography to them and pulling their pants down for him. Criminal defendants in Norway are not identified by name. (Nordlys, April 30, 2003) Clergyman says boredom led him to child porn
No evidence that the church had covered up the crimes committed, in fact, no mention of WHICH church this man pastored, for all we know, it could be Catholic.
An associate pastor of a San Fernando Valley chapel was sentenced to 32 months in prison on Tuesday for failing to register as a sex offender. Ilger, a former second-grade teacher, was convicted in 1988 of molesting four students in his San Luis Obispo classroom. After being released from jail, Ilger and his family moved to Los Angeles, where he took a position with Hope Chapel of the Valley in Canoga Park. "We've lived and learned a painful lesson," the Rev. Jeff Fischer of Hope Chapel said outside court. Fischer has said he and about 30 church elders knew that Ilger had molested young girls before he was hired. Sentencing (Associated Press, April 3, 2003)
And what evidence is there that the man harmed ANYONE in the church?
Marty A. Hynes, 33, is charged with eight counts of criminal sexual contact of a minor, three counts of criminal sexual penetration of a minor and one count of attempted criminal sexual contact of a minor. Hynes was a youth pastor at the First Assembly of God church when the alleged incidents occurred, between July and December 2001. (Las Cruces Sun-News, March 24, 2003) Trial of former youth pastor begins
NO evidence of Church cover up of criminal activity.
Milpitas, CA. A secretary to a LDS Bishop has admitted to sexually molesting four children, and will be sentenced to 14 years in prison. Craig Allen Harward, 54, pleaded guilty Monday to three counts of lewd and lascivious acts on children under the age of 14, and no contest to a fourth count of the same charge, Four of the case with the most convincing evidence involved four boys -- two of whom were 10, one 11 and another 13 years old at the time they were molested. (SAan Fransisco Chronicle, March 12, 2003) Child molester pleads guilty
So now the LDS ARE PROTESTANTS??? What's next, you going to lump in the Jehovah's Witnesses, Islam, and Judiasm in with Protestants?
Visalia, CA -- A 38-year-old Visalia man who was a leader in a local Jehovah's Witness congregation may face up to 16 years in prison on charges of sexually molesting a 12-year-old congregation member. Louis Anguiano served until last year as an elder at the Kingdom Hall of Jehovah's Witnesses at 5310 Caldwell Ave. He is accused of continuous sexual abuse, over a two-year period, of a girl who attended the same congregation. (The Fresno Bee, January 30, 2003) Visalian who was a Jehovah's Witness leader accused by girl, 12.
Apparently you will lump in Cultists with Christians if it suits your agenda. Not a very Christian attitude is it?
Tinley Park, IL. For the second time in two weeks, a Baptist pastor from New Lenox has been charged with molesting a child — and prosecutors said they are looking for more victims. Dennis Larry Shaw, 53, of the 2100 block of Sanford Drive, New Lenox, was charged Monday with aggravated criminal sexual abuse of a 16-year-old girl, according to the Will County state's attorney's office. On Jan. 31, Shaw was arrested on similar charges after a parishioner's 12-year-old daughter alleged she was fondled by the pastor inside the church between October and December, prosecutors said. (Daily Southtown, February 11, 2003) Minister again charged with molestation
Two arrests in two weeks is no evidence of a Church coverup of criminal activity.
Dayton, OH. A Trotwood minister, whose lawyer said he has been a "sex addict" since age 10, sought treatment rather than face trial in a Brookville police-run Internet sting that presented a virtual 14-year-old boy in a chat room. But a Montgomery County judge denied his plea for treatment Tuesday. Turner’s attorney, Dwight Brannon, wrote "He had his first sexual experience with another male at the age of 19 while in college. Shortly after he began surfing the Web . . . his addiction slowly began to grow." Turner had been pastor of Anchor Community Church, 38 S. Fairgreen Drive, for seven years when he was arrested last summer. (Dayton Daily News, 01.29.2003) Minister arrested in police-run Internet sting
No evidence of a coverup here
Lyons, NY. Former Lyons Minister Sentenced to 1 1/3 -3 years in State Prison. The retired minister of the Mount Zion Baptist Church in Lyons was sen-tenced to 1 1/3 to 3 years in state prisonon Tuesday (1/14). Grady O. KempSr., age 65, ofWadley, Georgia, pled guilty to a reduced crime of Course of Sexual Conduct Against a Child in the 2nd Degree-a Class D Felony on December 12, 2002, sparing the step-daughter from testifying. Kemp, when completing his prison term, must regis-ter as a sexual predator. He had been indicted by a Wayne County Grand Jury in July of last year, for one count of Sexual Mischief in the 1st Degree, 4 counts of Rape in the 2nd Degree, 2 counts of Rape in the 3rd Degree, 4 counts of Sex Abuse in the 2nd Degree, 2 counts of Sex Abuse in the 3rd Degree and one count of Sodomy in the 2nd Degree, involving a step daughter. Grady had been arrested on July 31, 2002. It is alleged that the sexual activity with a step daughter began when the girl was 9 years old and continued until she was 14. "He had sexual contact with the girl hundreds of times," said Wayne County District Attorney, Rick Healy. The incidents came to light when the girl, now 16 years old, began fidgeting and praying. The next day the girlbegan crying and screaming at a family gathering and said she could not hold it back any longer. The girl's mother and Kemp's former wife, Lynda Kemp, said she and her daughter now live in Panama City, Florida. According to Healy, Grady had served as pastor of the church for almost 20 years. "He just retired last year and moved to Georgia," said Healy. Grady still owned a house at 122 Ford Street in Newark, where the alleged crimes took place. (Times of Wayne County, Jan. 27, 2003)
No evidence of a cover up by the church here. It seems that this matter didn't involve the church in question at all.
A Tulare County minister admitted to molestation charges on Monday. Sabala worked as a minister at the Four-Square Church in Dinuba. (ABC30.com, Jan 27, 2003)
No evidence of a cover up here
Fort Pierce, FL. Pastor Kenneth Johnson, recently convicted of having sex with a minor, and Friendship Missionary Baptist Church -- where he reportedly continues to minister -- were named in a sex-abuse lawsuit filed Tuesday. Johnson, 39, is scheduled to be sentenced Friday on one count of unlawful sexual activity with a minor. He faces up to 15 years on the second-degree felony. (The Tribune, January 22, 2003) . Johnson to be sentenced Friday on 1 count of unlawful sexual activity with minor
i'll give this one to you, looks funny to me too.
Riviera Beach, FL. A prominent minister, his church and deacon have reached a $600,000 settlement with a mentally disabled man who accused the minister of rape. The Rev. Thomas Masters, pastor of the New Macedonia Church of Riviera Beach, and Church Mutual, insurer for the church, negotiated the settlement with the man, according to his attorneys and court papers filed Monday. The man, who has the mental capacity of a 7-year-old, attended New Macedonia and accused Masters of coercing him to smoke crack cocaine and then raping him twice on church property over Thanksgiving weekend in 1991. (The Palm Beach Post, January 14, 2003) West Palm Beach minister, church pay $600,000
Something funny about this one, no CRININAL charges, (forget statute of limitations, it can be waived in cases such as the plaintiff's retardation).
Athens, GA. Ralph Tulk, 63, was arrested Tuesday and charged with five counts of child molestation for allegedly inappropriately touching five children at Holy Trinity Lutheran Church over several years. He was superintendent of the Sunday school program when some of the alleged molestations took place and was treasurer of the church until last month, according to police and the church. Dickerson and many other residents of this Northeast Georgia city -- most of whom were willing to share their thoughts about the case but not be quoted -- said they worry about the church, but aren't yet convinced of the allegations. "This is America, and you are innocent until proven guilty," Dickerson said. (MSNBC.com, Jan. 11, 2003) Town reacts to molestation charges
Speaks for itself. Wonder what became of this case. You do realise that i'm going to follow up on each and every one of these incidents to find out the disposition of these cases don't you?
New Bedford, MA. An Attleboro Jehovah's Witnesses minister, Ralph Heroux, 74, yesterday pleaded not guilty to charges of two counts of rape of a child and two counts of indecent assault and battery on a child under 14. (The Standard Times, Jan. 2, 2003) Minister charged with child rape
Non Christian Arian Cult, and note that there is no word over whether the man was guilty or not, nor was there any suggestion of a Kingdom Hall cover up.
PROVINCETOWN, RI. The pastor of an Episcopal church in Provincetown has resigned and left town after admitting he sexually molested a teenage boy more than 25 years ago while assigned to a Maryland parish, church officials said. On Thursday, a 48-year-old man told the Baltimore diocese that he was molested by Barasda, who was a priest in the victim's parish. The abuse allegedly started in 1966, when the victim was 14 years old, and continued for two years, Arnold said. (The Boston Globe, 12/25/2002) Episcopal pastor admits molestation
NO evidence of a cover up by the local Epsicopal diocese.
The rest of these, including the one from my own Hometown (i'll let you figure out which one that is, HINT: it's not one i've covered), are of a similar nature, and it doesn't prove the point that Gamecock was making, namely there is no evidence of a large INSTITUTIONAL COVER UP of the crimes of Priests/ministers in Protestant circles.
You seem to be rationalising this away with the old "But EVERYBODY does it" ploy. Sorry, homey ain't buyin that one. Wrong is Wrong. While mem will fall, the church is not to cover up their sins.
You do however have my sympathy, indignation, and prayers. i have no desire to see the Roman Catholic Church face so ignoble a scandal. God Willing, true leadership will step up and DEAL WITH THE PROBLEM. That is my prayer for the Roman Catholic church.
Sorry to jump topic on your criticism of the Sola Scriptura issue, but the post needed addressing. Note that i will follow up on all the cases in this post, not just the ones i addressed.
Ahem!
*Qeo;ß h\n oJ lovgoß
Yes, it is a HUGE difference.
* font face used for Greek can be downloaded from here.
Your response: ...I am indebted to my Christian forefathers. I am indebted to Irenaus, Polycarp, Clement, Origen, Eusebius, Athanasius and so many others. I want to hug the neck of the author of the Didache when I see him! They are my brothers in Christ. But they are not my masters! I have but one master, and that is Christ. And he has told me that if I hear his words and put them into practice, my house will be built on the rock and I will whether the furious storm of the Last Judgement
Translation: "Well, actually I do have to rely on extra-scriptural authority to tell me which books are in the Bible, but instead of admitting it, I'm going to distract your attention by loudly proclaiming my faith in Jesus."
People use the Bible to the point of Biliolatry...Jesus said, "Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life" (John 5:39-40 KJV)
Things used are:
1. Scripture
2. Tradition - we look at various positions of the Church/Churches and those become the positions from which we view and interpret Scripture. Sola Scriptura is an illusion foisted by schismatics/Reformers in an effort to establish superiority and authority. It is - or should be - obvious that the Gospel and the Word of God activated by the Holy Spirit provided the foundation for the NT Church, the Bible being completed and accepted only many years after the death of the Apostles.
3. Reason - We are challenged to give a reason of the hope within us, and most people at least make an effort to be reasonable.
4. Experience - We all respond because of and through our own personal experience.
Just thinking...
Easy Answers ...
1. Did Our Lord write any part of the New Testament or command His Apostles to do so? Our Lord Himself never wrote a line, nor is there any record that He ordered His Apostles to write; He did command them to teach and to preach. Also He to whom all power was given in Heaven and on earth (Matthew 28-18) promised to give them the Holy Ghost (John 14-26) and to be with them Himself till the end of the world. (Matthew 28-20).
Comment: If reading the Bible were a necessary means of salvation, Our Lord would have made that statement and also provided the necessary means for His followers.
Answer: Jesus didn't write, nor did He commision the Apostles to write, .... other than commisioning John to write the Revelation ...Revelation 1:11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.Also, God inspired and commisioned men to write scripture ...
Rev. 1:19 Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter;
Rev. 14:13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them.
Rev. 19:9 And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.
Rev. 21:5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
Easy answers ...
2. How many of the Apostles or others actually wrote what is now in the New Testament? A few of the Apostles wrote part of Our Lords teachings, as they themselves expressly stated; i.e., Peter, Paul, James, John, Jude, Matthew, also Saints Mark and Luke. None of the others wrote anything, so far as is recorded.
Comment: If the Bible privately interpreted was to be a Divine rule of Faith, the Apostles would have been derelict in their duty when instead, some of them adopted preaching only.
Matthew, John, Peter, Paul, James, and Jude were inspired by God to write. See 2 Timothy 3:16
The other Apostles were not so inspired.
God has no requirement that He must call all to a task, ... simply because He calls some to a task.
This is so evident that it requires no further comment.
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