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To: OrthodoxPresbyterian
How very Pious of you, Dave... claim that I have besmirched your honor, called you a Liar -- and then say in turn that I "chose to overlay some other meaning than what is written"??

That's not an accusation of lying or pretending. That's simply a description of your own misunderstanding.

If you can't tell the difference, that's your own problem.

But the fact remains: you claim that "Christians do not follow this Law, We are living in grace, not under the Law"; and yet every time I present you specific examples of the Old Testament Law, you are both utterly unable to deny that these are Good Works for Christians,

Just like you are unable, every time I bring it up, to look at what Paul means by "the works of the law" in the context of the book of Galatians? Fine, I'll play your little game.

Yes, every example you give is an example of what could be considered a "Good work." For a Christian today. (Nevermind the counter-examples that you claim do not apply today or to Gentiles. I'll let you cherry pick. I'm very gracious.) But they are not what Paul is talking about. They are not "works of the law."

they are works of the Spirit, works of grace. To put it another way, if I do not kill because it is God's law, I am also following the laws of this state. That doesn't mean I am refraining form killing because of my fear of the state.

It is irrelevant that the laws of the state happen to be the same as the laws of God. So is the case here. The acts of a Christian in doing good works happen to be described in the old Law. But the Christian is not doing "works of the Law." The Christian is not following the Law.

To continue my analogy, I refrain from murder not because it is a state law and not even because it is God's law. I do so because it is not in my nature as a spirit-filled Christian to do so. I appear to "follow" and do "good works" as defined by both man's and God's law.

But in reality I am doing neither. I am following the Spirit in grace.

As I said earlier, it is astonishing that a Catholic has to argue grace versus legalism to a Protestant.

and also utterly unable to deny that the Old Testament Jews did practice these Laws by grace.

I'm not sure why you think I would deny that Jews followed the Law. It must make some sense to you.

SD

77 posted on 02/26/2004 7:20:22 AM PST by SoothingDave
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To: SoothingDave
To continue my analogy, I refrain from murder not because it is a state law and not even because it is God's law. I do so because it is not in my nature as a spirit-filled Christian to do so. I appear to "follow" and do "good works" as defined by both man's and God's law. But in reality I am doing neither. I am following the Spirit in grace. As I said earlier, it is astonishing that a Catholic has to argue grace versus legalism to a Protestant.

When the Old Testament believing Jews practiced the Good Works commanded in the Old Testament Law, is it your contention that they were NOT following the Spirit, in grace?

So: When the Old Testament believing Jews practiced the Good Works commanded in the Old Testament Law, is it your contention that they were NOT following the Spirit, in grace?

83 posted on 02/26/2004 8:01:12 AM PST by OrthodoxPresbyterian
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