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Brouhaha on Gibson Film Has a Plus
Jewish Journal ^
| 2-21-04
| Tom Tugend
Posted on 02/21/2004 6:15:06 AM PST by SJackson
Simon of Cyrene (Jarreth Merz) helps Jesus (Jim Caviezel) carry his cross. Photo by Philippe Antonello
There is at least one upside to the brouhaha over Mel Gibsons controversial film, "The Passion of the Christ": It has led to some serious probing of current Jewish-Christian relations and given many Jews a crash course in the varieties of Christian theology.
On Feb. 10, more than 750 Jews and Christians gathered in a Manhattan hotel to listen and participate in a debate between a rabbi and a messianic Jew on the question of who killed Jesus.
On the same evening in Los Angeles, a similarly mixed audience of approximately 400 at the University of Judaism (UJ) attended a more scholarly discussion on "Crucifying Jesus," ranging from the New Testament Gospels to contemporary interpretations and anxieties. The panel consisted of four academicians three Christian, one Jewish and if the Jews in the audience drew one lesson from the presentations it is of the diversity of views among Christians on the history and theology of their faith.
There are vast differences between denominations and between "radicals" and "conservatives" in the same church, said Dr. Kathryn Smith, who chairs the biblical studies department at the evangelical Azusa Pacific University. Besides not being monolithic, Christian views also change and evolve. "We are a theology in process," she said.
From the audience, UJ lecturer J. Shawn Landres put the case more graphically, observing, "Episcopalians, Mormons and Southern Baptists have even less in common than Reform Jews and Chabadniks."
The different views of Jesus life and teachings are already apparent in the four Gospels of the New Testament by Matthew, Mark, Luke and John, from which Gibson supposedly drew for his film. The Gospels are not history, and there are large variations among them, said professor Gary Gilbert, the lone Jew on the panel, who teaches a course on Jesus at Claremont-McKenna College.
"We dont even know whether Jesus was actually crucified," he said, adding, "There was no Jew more frum [religious] than Jesus."
For their indictment of Jewish culpability, two of the Gospel writers, Matthew and John, drew heavily on the pronouncements of the ancient prophets of Israel, who scourged their people for their sinfulness and shortcomings, observed Smith.
One panelist who had actually seen "The Passion of the Christ" was professor Jeffrey Siker, who heads the theological studies department at Loyola Marymount University.
"The film is not directly anti-Jewish," he said. "It reflects Gibsons highly personal testimony that Jesus, in dying for the sins of mankind, saved him [Gibson] as a sinner."
Siker likened Gibsons perspective to a T-shirt he saw, with a picture of a bloodied Jesus on the front and on the back the words "His Pain, Your Gain."
Professor John K. Roth, a prominent Holocaust scholar at Claremont-McKenna College, testified to his own deep Christian faith. At the same time, he acknowledged that while the Holocaust could not be solely blamed on Christianity, it was a "necessary condition" for the tragedy of the Shoah.
All the speakers agreed that Jesus was put to death primarily as a political rebel who threatened the political stability of Roman rule, although the leading Jewish priests, who owed their jobs to the Romans, encouraged Pontius Pilates decree. The panelists also agreed with a questioner that while the film would hardly inflame scholars of Christianity, the impact might be quite different on the man in the European or Arab street.
Professor Michael Berenbaum, director of the UJs Sigi Ziering Institute, which sponsored the event, added a provocative thought from the perspective of a Jewish historian. One or two centuries from now, he said, Jewish scholars might well look back on their peoples fate in the 20th century and see in it an analogy to Jesus progression from crucifixion to resurrection.
The final word came from Landres, who currently teaches the first course at the UJ on the theology and history of Christianity.
He has prepared a list of 10 dos and donts to guide Jewish responses to the issues raised by Gibsons film, which opens Feb. 25.
The first "commandment" reads: "Do what Jews do best. Study the sources. Read the Gospels for yourself, as well as Pauls letters, especially his letter to the Romans."
Another is, "Dont be afraid to stand up for yourself and the Jewish people, but do not be surprised if Christians wish to do the same for their faith."
And finally, the shortest and perhaps most practical suggestion of all is: "Dont forget that it isnt always about the Jews."
TOPICS: Current Events
KEYWORDS:
1
posted on
02/21/2004 6:15:06 AM PST
by
SJackson
To: SJackson
Thank you! I always wondered how to spell Brew-ha ha!
To: SJackson
Professor John K. Roth, a prominent Holocaust scholar at Claremont-McKenna College, testified to his own deep Christian faith. At the same time, he acknowledged that while the Holocaust could not be solely blamed on Christianity, it was a "necessary condition" for the tragedy of the Shoah. What an ass.
To: SJackson
The panelists also agreed with a questioner that while the film would hardly inflame scholars of Christianity, the impact might be quite different on the man in the European or Arab street.Elitism at its very worst. Frankly, they wouldn't know the attitudes on the "street" because they don't stoop so low (in their minds) as to go out on the "street." Fact is, we out here on the "street" are much more moral and civilized than these amoral ivory tower punks ever thought about being.
4
posted on
02/21/2004 6:38:20 AM PST
by
GaConfed
To: SJackson
"We dont even know whether Jesus was actually crucified . . " Hmmm.
To: SJackson
Professor John K. Roth, a prominent Holocaust scholar at Claremont-McKenna College, testified to his own deep Christian faith. At the same time, he acknowledged that while the Holocaust could not be solely blamed on Christianity, it was a "necessary condition" for the tragedy of the Shoah.He's wrong. The Nazis suppressed Christians too and had a sort of Germanic/Norse paganism as their guiding ideology. Reality is that Europe has hated Jews for a long time, Christianity or no.
Also the Germans kind of go nuts every 3rd generation or so and start a war or invasion.
6
posted on
02/21/2004 6:47:26 AM PST
by
ikka
To: SJackson
"the shortest and perhaps most practical suggestion of all is: "Dont forget that it isnt always about the Jews.""
How refreshing. I have been astounded at the response to this movie about Jesus. An interview I heard yest. was simply over the top. Why can't they "live and let live?" I do not think anyone actually expects violence against Jews from moviegoers! For some reason, some "elite opinion issuers" including non-Jews decided to make a big issue out of the fact that Gibson would have the nerve to make a movie like this, in this day and age.
When there is an anti-Christian film, or disgusting pictorial of a Christian symbol as "art", these "elite opinion issuers" tell Christians to "get over it: it is just free speech."
The hysteria has reached such a fever pitch lately, that I just have to laugh. The "elite opinion issuers" have upped the rhetoric because they have so far failed to stop the movie or run Gibson out of town on a rail . . . Funny - and sad too . . .
7
posted on
02/21/2004 6:52:06 AM PST
by
AMDG&BVMH
To: pettifogger
"We don't even know whether Jesus was actually crucified . . "
Hmmm . . . "Crucifixian deniers"?!? ;)
8
posted on
02/21/2004 7:04:23 AM PST
by
AMDG&BVMH
To: AMDG&BVMH
"The first "commandment" reads: "Do what Jews do best. Study the sources. Read the Gospels for yourself, as well as Pauls letters, especially his letter to the Romans." "
THIS is where the power of the film lies. Maybe all the controversy will goad people into taking this step, and when they do . . .
9
posted on
02/21/2004 7:04:50 AM PST
by
walden
To: walden
"Maybe all the controversy will goad people into taking this step, and when they do . . . "
It is certainly having this effect on a number of Christians who wouldn't otherwise have gone to the movie. Whether it will have any effect on others, remains to be seen, but "God works in mysterious ways . . ."
To: Always Right
Professor John K. Roth, a prominent Holocaust scholar at Claremont-McKenna College, testified to his own deep Christian faith. At the same time, he acknowledged that while the Holocaust could not be solely blamed on Christianity, it was a "necessary condition" for the tragedy of the Shoah. I wonder of "Professor" Roth is aware that JESUS WAS A JEW?!?!?
To: ikka
The Nazis were not Christians. They tried to outlaw the cross and replace it with a swastika.
To: SJackson
"One or two centuries from now, he said, Jewish scholars might well look back on their peoples fate in the 20th century and see in it an analogy to Jesus progression from crucifixion to resurrection."
Unless Israel takes some decisive action, one or two centuries from now....Jews will not have a homeland, and europe will be barren of jews. America is/will be thier only refuge.
It's amazing there would be a uproar about this while genocide-by-attrition is actively taking place in Israel itself. Just amazing stupidity. Banal. Ridiculous. Now Sharon is tearing down some of the wall. Welcome death with open arms Sharon.
All the conspiracy theories about jews ruling the world, media, and wanting a world government just don't fly anymore.
To: SJackson
"One or two centuries from now, he said, Jewish scholars might well look back on their peoples fate in the 20th century and see in it an analogy to Jesus progression from crucifixion to resurrection."
Unless Israel takes some decisive action, one or two centuries from now....Jews will not have a homeland, and europe will be barren of jews. America is/will be thier only refuge.
It's amazing there would be a uproar about this while genocide-by-attrition is actively taking place in Israel itself. Just amazing stupidity. Banal. Ridiculous. Now Sharon is tearing down some of the wall. Welcome death with open arms Sharon.
All the conspiracy theories about jews ruling the world, media, and wanting a world government just don't fly anymore.
To: ikka
European anti-Semitism had/has numerous roots. Religious hatred of Jews as "Christ-killers" is one of them and cannot be denied or swept under the rug. It is an historical fact that many churches condemned all Jews for the death of Christ, especially in the Middle Ages.
Then there was racist hatred of Jews as being an "inferior race," as opposed to Aryans, supposedly the "master race," and other European races were also considered to be inferior to the Aryans. In this imaginary scheme, blacks were even more inferior, sub-human, and most Asians little better, except for the Japanese, who were "almost white."
Then there was class hatred of Jews for supposedly controlling all the money, and ideological hatred of Jews for supposedly being behind the Communist movement.
It seems to me that all these hatreds devolve backwards to religious anti-Semitism, but it may not matter. There were many alleged "reasons" for hating Jews, long before the Nazis came into power. Hitler's hatred of Jews was more virulent, more insane, but he could not have gotten the rest of Europe to cooperate in the Holocaust unless they, too, hated Jews.
Thus, in nations where anti-Semitism was not as pronounced as in Germany, such as Italy and the Netherlands, the population was willing to hide Jews and help them escape. In nations where anti-Semitism was even more pronounced than in Germany, such as Ukraine and Yugoslavia, the population willingly cooperated and even innovated.
To: ragnarocker
Some Nazis were Christians. Some were not. National Socialism was primarily a political movement, but it also had quasi-religious elements which not all Nazis signed onto.
To: ragnarocker
Many Jews served in Hitler's military, unbeknownst to Hitler himself, to avoid being turned into POW's and killed.
17
posted on
02/21/2004 2:29:25 PM PST
by
BigSkyFreeper
(Liberalism is Communism one drink at a time. - P.J. O'Rourke)
To: CobaltBlue
Then there was class hatred of Jews for supposedly controlling all the money, and ideological hatred of Jews for supposedly being behind the Communist movement.Communism was anti-Jewish from the start. Remember Karl Marx talking about ``Money being the jealous god of Israel.'' Hitler's anti-Judaism was stoked by left-wing sources.
Many of those intellectuals of the 19th century regarded Christianity as a ``Jewish religion'' imposed on Europe. Some of the militia group movements today have picked up on that idea, and are anti-Christian.
18
posted on
02/21/2004 4:41:21 PM PST
by
nickcarraway
(www.terrisfight.org)
To: CobaltBlue
The Righteous: The Unsung Heroes of the Holocaust by Martin Gilbert
Drawing from twenty-five years of original research, Sir Martin Gilbert re-creates the remarkable stories of non-Jews who risked their lives to help Jews during the Holocaust
According to Jewish tradition, "Whoever saves one life, it is as if he saved the entire world." Non-Jews who helped save Jewish lives during World War II are designated Righteous Among the Nations by Yad Vashem, the Holocaust archive in Jerusalem. In The Righteous, distinguished historian Sir Martin Gilbert, through extensive interviews, explores the courage of those who-throughout Germany and in every occupied country from Norway to Greece, from the Atlantic to the Baltic-took incredible risks to help Jews whose fate would have been sealed without them. Indeed, many lost their lives for their efforts.
Those who hid Jews included priests, nurses, teachers, neighbors and friends, employees and colleagues, soldiers and diplomats, and, above all, ordinary citizens. From Greek Orthodox Princess Alice of Greece, who hid Jews in her home in Athens, to the Ukrainian Uniate Archbishop of Lvov, who hid hundreds of Jews in his churches and monasteries, to Muslims in Bosnia and Albania, many risked, and lost, everything to help their fellow man.
19
posted on
02/21/2004 4:44:00 PM PST
by
nickcarraway
(www.terrisfight.org)
To: nickcarraway
It was an article of faith among the Nazi paranoiacs that Communism was a Jewish conspiracy - because several of the early Communists were Jew, e.g., Marx, Trotsky - this was distorted to an allegation that almost all early Communists were Jews, e.g., Engels, Lenin. I have an illustrated book published in Germany the 1930s about German reparations that has, as one illustration, an octopus gripping the world - it has simultaneously Communist symbols and a caricature Jew face, with earlocks.
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