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To: dangus
“Many are called, but few are chosen (Matthew 22:14)."

“Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden.” (from Romans 9)

Verses 1 Thessalonians 5:9 and Acts 13:48 both say Christian believers are "appointed to" salvation and eternal life. Both passages, in their context and textual statements exclude this appointment from being given to everybody (and logic would argue for only some being appointed since not all are saved and an appointment is an act of decree). At the Garden of Gethsemene, Jesus prayed for the salvation of some people, not everyone. Why would Jesus do this if it was God's will to save everyone? This supports the conclusion that Jesus did not die for everyone, but only a group of predestined people. It says in John 17:1-2:

"Jesus spoke these words, lifted up His eyes to heaven, and said: 'Father, the hour has come. Glorify Your Son, that Your Son also may glorify You, as You have given Him authority over all flesh, that He should give eternal life to as many as You have given Him.'"

Another predestination passage, Ephesians 1:4-5, says, "For He chose us in Him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in His sight. In love He predestined us to be adopted as His sons through Jesus Christ, in accordance with His pleasure and will." In 1 Peter 2:6, Jesus is referred to as a "chosen cornerstone." In verses 7-9, it states this to believer:

"Now to you who believe, this stone is precious. But to those who do not believe, "The stone the builders rejected has become the capstone," and, "A stone that causes men to stumble and a rock that makes them fall." They stumble because they disobey the message-- which is also what they were destined for. But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people belonging to God, that you may declare the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light."

2 Thessalonians 2:13 gives comfort to believers by saying, "But we ought always to thank God for you, brothers loved by the Lord, because from the beginning God chose you to be saved through the sanctifying work of the Spirit and through belief in the truth." God chose people to be saved. Names were written into the Book of Life from the foundation of the world (Revelation 17:8).

It says in 1 Corinthians 2:14 that “The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.” The Gospel of salvation in Christ comes from the Holy Spirit. This only makes sense because it is a spiritual (Spirit-given) truth. Scripture declares God chooses to use the “foolishness of preaching to save (1 Corinthians 1:21).” The Gospel is what is preached to the nations and if preaching is foolishness to human minds, the spiritual truth of the Gospel has to be even bigger foolishness to people without the Spirit, everyone not saved. As Romans 3:11 declares, "There is none who understands, there is none who seeks for God." This is a quotation the author uses from the OT, which proves the continuity of the total depravity of man from the fall of Adam to the current dispensation of grace through Christ. Romans 8:7 shows that the sinful, carnal man does not have the ability to submit to God's law and is hostile to God. The Psalmist admits he was sinful from conception (Psalm 51:5). Every inclination of the heart of man is wicked (Genesis 8:21).

The dry bones in Ezekiel 36-37 only come alive by direct command of God; they are spiritually dead and can't come alive by some "choice" they make.
100 posted on 02/01/2004 1:37:28 PM PST by rwfromkansas ("Men stumble over the truth, but most pick themselves up as if nothing had happened." Churchill)
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To: rwfromkansas
Yeah, I knew that would attract a Calvinist tract. Been there, debated that. Not that any of that stuff you said is untrue... It's just that it's not the whole story.

First, understand that God doesn't exist merely *in* time. Picture the universe as a book. It's there, written... all of it. God sees it as it is: The beginning, middle and end. To him, it's not changing. To we whose consciousness is *in* time, it's like we're just reading through it. We can grasp so little of it, it seems to us to be constantly changing. It's not like he is surprised half-way through the book by the choice we made, but neither is it that he creates a character, then erases it, replacing it with a different character.

When someone makes a free choice, "free" means that its not based on any outside factor. If I offer you a baseball tickets or a carton of OJ, and you are stuc, stranded in the desert dying of thirst, you will choose the OJ. That's not freely chosen; your cicumstances dictated it.

So a free choice is based on the characteristics of the person making the choosing. It's like Predestinationists think we're saying that the choice is based on some outside, arbitrary factor. It's based on who we are as the creation of God.

It's about where you put the accent. To deny free will is to render the moral decisions we make meaningless, and to isolate our past from our future.
107 posted on 02/01/2004 10:13:27 PM PST by dangus
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