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To: maui_hawaii
When the light rested upon me I saw two Personages, whose brightness and dglory defy all description, standing above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the other—This is My Beloved Son. Hear Him!

Let's first get to a point using something we both agree is authentic and not some contrived drivel written by someone who claimed to be a prophet of God and yet failed at his basic prophecies...You do know a true prophet of God has to at least show his prophecies to be true?

"Hearken, O ye elders of my church, saith the Lord your God, who have assembled yourselves together, according to my commandments, in this land, which is the land of Missouri, which is the land I have appointed and consecrated for the gathering of the saints. Wherefore, this is the land of promise, and the place for the city of Zion. And thus saith the Lord your God, if you will receive wisdom here is wisdom. Behold, the place which is now called Independence is the center place; and a spot for the temple is lying westward, upon a lot which is not far from the court-house."

Doctrine and Covenants, Section 57:1-3 Revelation given through Joseph Smith the Prophet, in Zion, Jackson County, Missouri, July, 1831.

Where's that temple going up again ole Joe?

What's amazing is he had the audacity to repeat this so-called prophecy in 1832 and again in 1833!

I'm sorry three strikes, and you're out!Believe me, there are many things he said and wrote that have have never come true not even by the slightest imaginations...Now if you believe that he was a true prophet of God then you can not believe God has a standard for true prophets.

159 posted on 12/25/2003 6:31:28 PM PST by sirchtruth
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To: sirchtruth
I believe you have not even studied what he said or did. It is Far more than fortune telling as what your definition of a prophet is.

But even at that it ain't over yet. Just because things haven't happened according to your time table means very little.

162 posted on 12/25/2003 6:36:18 PM PST by maui_hawaii
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To: sirchtruth
Secondly if you can quote yourself and some obscure historian, I can quote Joseph Smith. I think he is qualified to say what Mormons believe in. Which IS what we are discussing.
163 posted on 12/25/2003 6:46:41 PM PST by maui_hawaii
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To: sirchtruth
You've tried to evolve the conversation from what Mormons believe in to 'lets subtly bash the mormons' or 'lets compare what mormons believe in to what "I" believe in'; or any combination of the two.
164 posted on 12/25/2003 6:49:10 PM PST by maui_hawaii
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