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To: Hermann the Cherusker
The Holy Ghost gave power to Mary to conceive Christ within her womb. He did not impregnate her with a child with no genetic connection to her.

"to become pregnant with" is the intransitive, as in "you shall conceive a child"

Once again I appreciate your use of scripture to discuss and interpret scripture. I wish more people would do this. If it weren't for the verse about John the Baptist I would certainly not make this strange statement about conception. However it's there and Marianism iis too which is probably why the verse jumped out at me.

I know that Catholics deeply desire a more active role for Mary because of the much doctrine they have build around her so I know this doesn't sit well at all. I've not met very many Christians outside the Catholic church that have a problem with the concept though. The bible says God can raise sons of Abraham from stones so there is no problem with believing that God can raise up the Son of Man in what ever way He wants.

283 posted on 11/10/2003 6:13:19 AM PST by biblewonk (I must answer all bible questions.)
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To: biblewonk
Once again I appreciate your use of scripture to discuss and interpret scripture.

We Catholics are most capable of doing this.

"to become pregnant with" is the intransitive, as in "you shall conceive a child"

Do you see the linguistic difference between "the in vitro fertilization clinic impregnated my daughter 3 months ago" and "my daughter conceived her child 3 months ago"?

The Holy Spirit acted upon Mary by utilizing her genetic material to create Christ. Thus "Behold thou shalt conceive in thy womb" (St. Luke 1.31).

St. Luke also creates an implicit parallel between Adam and Christ (drawn out by St. Paul in Romans 5 and 1 Corinthians 15) in the manner of their creation. Thus: "who was the son of Adam, who was the son of God" (St. Luke 3.38) "And therefore also the Holy which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God." (St. Luke 1.35) Now Adam was created by God using existing matieral "slime of the earth" (Genesis 2.7), not ex nihilo. Similarly, the Body of Christ was fashioned by God from Mary, not created ex nihilo - "a body thou hast fitted to me" (Hebrews 10.5). Thus Mary truly conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit.

I know that Catholics deeply desire a more active role for Mary because of the much doctrine they have build around her so I know this doesn't sit well at all. I've not met very many Christians outside the Catholic church that have a problem with the concept though. The bible says God can raise sons of Abraham from stones so there is no problem with believing that God can raise up the Son of Man in what ever way He wants.

Yes, God could do anything He wanted, but that is not what He has revealed to us! Christ is of the flesh of Mary coming down from Abraham and David. St. Paul is most clear about this: "For no where doth he take hold of the angels: but of the seed of Abraham he taketh hold." (Hebrews 2.16) and "Concerning his Son, who was made to him of the seed of David, according to the flesh" (Romans 1.3) "But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent his Son, made of a woman" (Galatians 4.4)

Christ in the flesh is the physical genetic descendant of Mary, and through her, David and Abraham and Noah and Adam.

285 posted on 11/10/2003 7:30:44 AM PST by Hermann the Cherusker
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