India may topple US in hi-tech areas: Intel founder

Economic Times of India ^ | October 10, 2003 | T V PARASURAM

[sarcasm]

WASHINGTON: Observing that India and China are "key threats" to continued US dominance in important high technology sectors, Intel Chairman Andrew S Grove has said India could surpass America in software and tech-service jobs by 2010.

India's booming software industry, which is increasingly doing work for US companies, could surpass America in software and tech-service jobs by 2010, Grove, one of the founding fathers of America's hi-tech industry and co-founder of Intel, told a global technology summit in Washington via satellite yesterday.

He warned that America's software and service industries, strong drivers of US economic growth for nearly two decades, show signs of emulating the struggles of the US steel and semiconductor industries.

He said that the nation's software and service businesses are under siege by countries like India and China taking advantage of cheap labour costs and strong incentives for new financial investment. While the US economy as a whole is improving, its high-tech employment is not, he added.

According to industry figures, he pointed out, more than half a million technology jobs were lost from mid-2001 to mid-2003. Many of these losses were due to a contraction of the tech sector after the dot.com bubble (in the telecommunications sector) burst in 2000.

Grove said the US tech industry itself is responsible for numerous jobs leaving the country, as firms take advantage of considerably cheaper labour costs in India and elsewhere.

He himself is "torn between" his responsibility to his shareholders to cut costs and improve profits and to US workers who helped build the nation's technology industry, but who are now being replaced by cheaper labour, Grove said, asking the US Government to help decide the proper balance between the two.

The conference was provided recent estimates from financial consulting firms painting a stark picture of "offshoring," which allows companies to get software development and other services from countries like India at one-sixth the US cost.

The Gartber Group, a market research firm estimates that 10 per cent of jobs at US information technology vendors will move offshore by next year. Another research firm, Forrester Research, estimates that throughout all US companies, there will be a loss of roughly 3.3 million jobs by 2015 due to offshore moves.

Grove told the conference that the move offshore has been aided by the busting of the telecommunications bubble of the late 1990s. So much infrastructure for high-speed Internet connections was laid, much of it never used, that the cost of achieving high-speed communication plummeted. As a result, Grove said, "the engineer sitting 6,000 miles away might as well be in the next cubicle."

Chiding US policymakers for "all but ignoring the problem," Grove said, "What is US public policy? I am hard put to find a document outlining a policy strategy

[sarcasm]

Chiding US policymakers for "all but ignoring the problem," Grove said, "What is US public policy? I am hard put to find a document outlining a policy strategy

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[XBob]

US policy - screw the American worker

Republican - export US jobs for cheap labor

Democrat - import illegals and legals for cheap labor and votes

Result - turn US into a 3rd world country with no middle class, only the peons and the ruling class.

[McGavin999]

He himself is "torn between" his responsibility to his shareholders to cut costs and improve profits and to US workers who helped build the nation's technology industry, but who are now being replaced by cheaper labour, Grove said, asking the US Government to help decide the proper balance between the two.

Well, here's a clue for you. Who buys your products and what happens when they don't have jobs so they CAN buy your products?

[DB]

It isn't that easy.

If Intel can't compete with off shore companies Intel won't provide any jobs not to far down the road regardless how true they stay to their customers.

[McGavin999]

Then they can all go down together because it's true for all of them. As to China's economy, they sell most of their stuff to us. What happens when we stop buying?

Eventually, it'll all come crashing down, Americans will pick themselves back up and slowly start selling "stuff" to each other (because that's what we do) and life will go on.

How do you think all those "execs" will like life in China when the state comes in and confiscates everything?

[JesseHousman]

...turn US into a 3rd world country with no middle class, only the peons and the ruling class.

Why, Bob, you've stumbled onto the dirty little secret that our fearless leaders thought was hidden.

The plan is to drain the USA of most worthwhile means of creating wealth and jobs by transferring those choice chessmen to what has been termed "Third World Nations."

With all our valuable chess pieces gone, the only thing left will be those pawns in the front rank. This makes it much easier to fold the USA into the globalists' fondest dream: One World, One Government, One Currency.

It couldn't be accomplished while the USA had all their chesspieces in place.

Now you, as well as many others, get the true picture Bob. To those who are deliberately ruining this nation on the CFR Trilateralist Altar of One Worldism, that lofty goal can only be reached after our USA itself resembles a Third World Nation!

We go to the polls and vote for new members of the political class to rule over us, but it does no good as newbies have already taken the pledge, sold their souls to satan, and are worshipping at the CFR-Trilateralist Church.

We've sat around in a daze for so long that all this conspiracy, that many call bullscheist, going around in front of our eyes that somehow we've missed it. Our children and grandchildren will pay the price of our inattentiveness, however.

The media is busy showing what's happening with Kobe and they're not on our side anyway.

If there was a way MacDonalds could make the pseudo-hamburgers in China, as well as the buns and fries, then ship them over here to be heated and sold, they'd do it.

The lights in America are truly going out and the only clue Americans will have is that their television won't work and nobody in Norte America knows how to fix it. Have to call that 800 number in Bangalore to get help.

[JohnSmithee]

"He himself is "torn between" his responsibility to his shareholders to cut costs and improve profits and to US workers who helped build the nation's technology industry, but who are now being replaced by cheaper labour, Grove said, asking the US Government to help decide the proper balance between the two."

Wait a second here. Don't some of the rabid "free traders" here keep insisting that this will never happen. If anything this is a "good" thing since it's the market at work? Even Andy Grove disagrees with them. Guess he's just another whiner, eh?

[joyful1]

INTC (Intel stock symbol)

I'm buying at $31 a share monday am!!

Can't lose in this market!$$

[ItisaReligionofPeace]

Why complicate things with little things like facts?

[ItisaReligionofPeace]

First of all, your hysterical post could easily be mistaken for a 1920's newspaper article deriding the deluge of immigrants into America.

Second, how in the world do spell one of the world's most recognizable brands? (MacDonalds?)

[HadEnough]

You got it!

These Indian programmers (I don't call them SW engineers) work cheap but are very poor designers. Their primary deliverables are deadlocks, race conditions, memory leaks and chaos.

[kittymyrib]

Oh, I'm sure that since the companies are only paying 1/6th as much to produce their products in India, they will only charge 1/6th as much for their products when they sell them in the US. Isn't that the lie we always get from the globalists? And I rarely see any of these bargain-basement prices show up on the store shelf. They still keep charging about what they would have charged for USA-made products. I think Groves could probably be replaced by an Indian CEO for a huge cost savings to Intell.

[dennisw]

Grove is former CEO at Intel

[HadEnough]

"The lights in America are truly going out and the only clue Americans will have is that their television won't work and nobody in Norte America knows how to fix it. Have to call that 800 number in Bangalore to get help."

My wife spent two hours yesterday on the phone with Dell's Indian Tech Support Connection. To date, they have sent the wrong laptop adapter AC cord three times. My wife finally went postal and demanded to speak with someone who UNDERSTOOD English. They put her on hold for 15 minutes and finally connected here with an American English speaker back in Austin. He finally admitted that poor little startup Dell uses the slave labor in India to save money.

[DB]

I'll say right off the top that I don't know what the answer is.

I will say that at some point in time the rest of the world had to modernize and in doing so become more competitive with us. We are an open society and publish all of our acquired knowledge publicly. This provides a shortcut to development/modernization for the rest of the world. It has always only been just a matter of time until they catch up.

The Internet has accelerated this trend significantly.

I believe (and could well be wrong) that this will have some positive features to it as well. It causes other societies to open up making totalitarian rule more difficult there. One would hope that this could lead to the reduction of the amount of pain and suffering in much of the currently less developed world in time.

[DB]

Dell once had world-class service bar none.

Then customers started demanding $600 PCs because others offered them.

You can't have $600 PCs along with people’s time providing excellent service - something had to give and sadly it did.

The worst thing is their service declined across the board. It doesn’t matter if you bought their high-end machine or latest TV special. The personalized service is basically gone.

[JesseHousman]

I had the same experience this past week with my Dell.

I couldn't understand what the Indian was telling me and after 2 hours of opening and closing my tower he decided that the speaker system on my new Dell needed replacement.

The speakers came and it didn't make any difference. A week before this, I had to call Bangalore when my new hard drive flummoxed and had to be replaced. When parts are replaced the Indian schedules Americanos to come in with the new parts.

We're all sick and tired of this crap, but don't know what they hell we can do about it.

I stopped buying ALL products manufactured in China, much to our grandchildren's dismay as they have to go without teddy bears, trains and other things we considered essential forty years ago. Every damned teddy is made by America hating Chinese as is EVERY Christmas ornament.

This latter thing makes no freaking sense as it was just before Christmas last year that the Chi Coms executed by firing squad 48 Chinese Christians.

[FITZ]

Result - turn US into a 3rd world country with no middle class, only the peons and the ruling class.

They're putting dollar stores in the malls here ---- as the stores that sell quality shut down, they have to fill the empty spaces with something. I won't be surprised when they get a Goodwill store in the malls.