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A Missing Statistic: U.S. Jobs That Went Overseas
The NY Times ^ | 100503 | LOUIS UCHITELLE

Posted on 10/04/2003 2:52:53 PM PDT by Archangelsk

A Missing Statistic: U.S. Jobs That Went Overseas By LOUIS UCHITELLE

The job market finally showed some life in September, but not enough to sidetrack a growing debate over why employment has failed to rebound nearly two years after the last recession ended. The debate intrudes increasingly on election politics, but in all the heated back and forth, an essential statistic is missing: the number of jobs that would exist in the United States today if so many had not escaped abroad.

The Labor Department, in its numerous surveys of employers and employees, has never tried to calculate this trade-off. But the "offshoring" of work has become so noticeable lately that experts in the private sector are now trying to quantify it.

By these initial estimates, at least 15 percent of the 2.81 million jobs lost in America since the decline began have reappeared overseas. Productivity improvements at home — sustaining output with fewer workers — account for the great bulk of the job loss. But the estimates being made suggest that the work sent overseas has been enough to raise the unemployment rate by four-tenths of a percentage point or more, to the present 6.1 percent.

That leakage fuels the political debate. The Bush administration is pushing the Chinese to allow their currency to rise in value, thus increasing the dollar value of wages in that country, a deterrent to locating work abroad. The Democrats agree, but some also call for trade restrictions, and they attack Republicans for cutting from the budget funds to retrain and support laid-off workers in the United States.

While most of the lost jobs are in manufacturing or in telephone call centers, lately the work sent abroad has climbed way up the skills ladder to include workers like aeronautical engineers, software designers and stock analysts as China, Russia and India, with big stocks of educated workers, merge rapidly into the global labor market.

"All of a sudden you have a huge influx of skilled people; that is a very disruptive process," said Craig R. Barrett, chief executive of Intel, the computer chip manufacturer.

Intel itself has maintained a fairly steady 60 percent of its employees in the United States. But in the past year or so, it has added 1,000 software engineers in China and India, doing work that in the past might have been done by people hired in the United States. "To be competitive, we have to move up the skill chain overseas," Mr. Barrett said.

The trade-off in jobs is not one for one. The work done here by one person often requires two or three less-efficient workers overseas. Even so, given the very low wages, the total saving for an American company can be as much 50 percent for each job shifted, even allowing for the extra cost of transportation, communication and other expenses that would not be needed if the work was done in the United States. That is the message of the nation's management consultants, who are encouraging their corporate clients to take advantage of the multiplying opportunities overseas.

" `Encourage' is a difficult way to put it," said Harold Sirkin, a senior vice president at the Boston Consulting Group. "What we are basically saying is that if your competitors are doing this, you will be at a disadvantage if you don't do it too."

The estimates of job loss from offshoring are all over the lot. They are back-of-the-envelope calculations at best, inferred from trade data and assumptions about the number of American workers needed to produce goods and services now coming from abroad, or no longer exported to a growing consumer market in, say, China.

Among economists and researchers, the high-end estimate comes from Mark Zandi, chief economist at Economy.com, who calculates that 995,000 jobs have been lost overseas since the last recession began in March 2001. That is 35 percent of the total decline in employment since then. While most of the loss is in manufacturing, about 15 percent is among college-trained professionals.

Boeing, for example, employs engineers at a design center in Moscow, while having shrunk its engineering staff in Seattle. Morgan Stanley, the investment firm, is adding jobs in Bombay, but not in New York — employing Indian engineers as well as analysts who collect corporate data and scrutinize balance sheets for stock market specialists in New York. Lehman Brothers, Citigroup and J. P. Morgan, the investment arm of J. P. Morgan Chase, are also setting up shop in India. Other American companies contract with Indian firms to do their work.

"When we have a software glitch at our headquarters in New York," said Stephen S. Roach, chief economist at Morgan Stanley, "we send an e-mail to our engineers in India and they fix it and they e-mail it back and it is wired right into the mainframe in New York."

Near the low end of the job-loss estimates sit John McCarthy, research analyst at Forrester Research Inc., and Nariman Behravesh, chief economist at Global Insights. For them the loss is 500,000 to 600,000 jobs over the past 30 months, again mostly in manufacturing — with Mr. McCarthy suggesting that the 600,000 might turn out to be 800,000. His research focuses more on the future: Starting in January 2000 and running through 2015, globalization of American production will have eliminated 3.3 million jobs at home, he estimates.

Some are trying niche estimates. Roshi Sood, a government analyst at the Gartner Group, for example, estimates roughly that state government cutbacks have pushed overseas the work of 3,400 people once employed in the United States, either on public payrolls or on the payrolls of companies that contract with state government.

In Indiana, for example, the Department of Workforce Development recently chose an Indian company, TCS America, to maintain and update its computer programs, using high-speed telecommunications to carry out the contract. The TCS bid was $8 million below those submitted by two American competitors, Mr. Sood said.

Now political groups are offering estimates. The Progressive Policy Institute, which is affiliated with the Democratic Party, will soon publish its calculation of manufacturing jobs shifted overseas since George W. Bush took office just before the recession began, said Rob Atkinson, a vice president. Not surprisingly, the estimate — imputed from trade data — is on the high side: 800,000 jobs lost to overseas production.



TOPICS: Business/Economy; Foreign Affairs; Government
KEYWORDS: engineers; offshoring; skilledworkers; unemployment
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Whoops, start your statistical databases.
1 posted on 10/04/2003 2:52:54 PM PDT by Archangelsk
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To: All

Let's keep the Dem's on the run!
Click the Pic!

2 posted on 10/04/2003 2:54:00 PM PDT by Support Free Republic (Your support keeps Free Republic going strong!)
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To: Archangelsk
And before anyone gets all prehistoric, consider the cost of retraining the skilled workers (engineers, accountants, etc.) who have been displaced and who is going to bear the cost.
3 posted on 10/04/2003 2:55:22 PM PDT by Archangelsk (Air conditioners are for wimps.)
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To: harpseal
Ping!
4 posted on 10/04/2003 2:56:04 PM PDT by TopDog2
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To: Archangelsk
They didn't "went" overseas. They were forced to relocate because of all the constraints and costs Liberalism has imposed on them and I don't blame them.

Payroll taxes, mandatory health insurance, OSHA regulations, EPA regulations, hiring regulations, firing regulations, worker's comp, disability, and hundreds of other government imposed sanctions on businesses is what is causing these companies to bug out.

You ever wonder why so few Liberals are entrepreneurs? Because they know damn well just how many ludicrous hurdles there are for them to jump just to keep a government agency or lawyer from coming in and relieving them from every penny they've ever earned.

Hypocrites. We need to outsource Liberalism.

5 posted on 10/04/2003 3:03:20 PM PDT by Texas Eagle
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To: Archangelsk
Already posted ..

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/995166/posts
6 posted on 10/04/2003 3:05:44 PM PDT by WOSG (DONT PUT CALI ON CRUZ CONTROL & VOTE YES ON 54!)
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To: Archangelsk
The answer is simple: require employers to hire 1 new worker for every, oh, 20 they have now. At a living wage, of course. Presto, unemployment vanishes.
7 posted on 10/04/2003 3:05:55 PM PDT by John Jorsett
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To: Archangelsk
If you had done a search you would have found the article already posted.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/995166/posts
8 posted on 10/04/2003 3:08:16 PM PDT by Libertarianize the GOP (Ideas have consequences)
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To: Archangelsk
My job didn't go anywhere. My job belongs to me. I was born with it. Nobody can send it away. I take it with me everywhere.
9 posted on 10/04/2003 3:27:05 PM PDT by Prodigal Son
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To: Archangelsk
how much of jobs going overseas belongs in the unions' lap?

i remember back in the late 1980s lockheed ship workers went on strike. after a few weeks the union went to the democRATs in olympia and more or less demanded unemployment benefits be given to the strikers. after a couple of days lockheed said go ahead and give it to the workers as we are going to sell everything and shut down.

lots of high paying jobs were lost.


10 posted on 10/04/2003 4:00:13 PM PDT by camas
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To: Archangelsk; All
A Missing Statistic: U.S. Jobs That Went Overseas

Bush is a one termer...(see my tag line)

11 posted on 10/04/2003 4:53:44 PM PDT by Lael (Bush to Middle Class: Send your kids to DIE in Iraq while I send your LIVELIHOODS to INDIA!)
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To: Texas Eagle
They didn't "went" overseas. They were forced to relocate because of all the constraints and costs Liberalism has imposed on them and I don't blame them.

Payroll taxes, mandatory health insurance, OSHA regulations, EPA regulations, hiring regulations, firing regulations, worker's comp, disability, and hundreds of other government imposed sanctions on businesses is what is causing these companies to bug out.

Not to mention out of control litigation in this country which is jacking up the cost of doing business here as well.

Lawyers are destroying this country.

12 posted on 10/04/2003 6:10:14 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Texas Eagle
Excuse me? We had the same conditions here 100 years ago that the overseas employers have now. Is it your contention that we (you and I, buddy) should give up the American Way of life because it is cheaper for CORPORATIONS?

Get a grip.
13 posted on 10/04/2003 7:05:19 PM PDT by Harlequin (the difference between theory and practice is bigger in practice than in theory)
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To: Jorge
Not to mention out of control litigation in this country which is jacking up the cost of doing business here as well.

Amen.

14 posted on 10/04/2003 7:08:04 PM PDT by Texas Eagle
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To: Harlequin
A)We had the same conditions here 100 years ago that the overseas employers have now.

Um, it is no longer 100 years ago.

B) Is it your contention that we (you and I, buddy) should give up the American Way of life because it is cheaper for CORPORATIONS?

No. Wait. Because what is cheaper for CORPORATIONS?

15 posted on 10/04/2003 7:11:04 PM PDT by Texas Eagle
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To: Texas Eagle
And your point would be....?
16 posted on 10/04/2003 8:13:40 PM PDT by Harlequin (the difference between theory and practice is bigger in practice than in theory)
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To: Archangelsk
Someone has to make it clear in the public arena what is going on here. Ok, in Silicon Valley you are a computer engineer and you make a measly $100,000, barely enough to get by there unless you live in a cheap apartment. Your employer pays $7650 in Social Security and Medicare taxes, $9000 for Worker's Comp, $6000 or so in health insurance, making the minimum your employer has to pay out just for you(not including things like unemployment insurance) $122,650. If your employer can get the same job done in India or China for $3000, which one would he choose? If the employer is listed on the stock exchange, he is there to make profits for the stockholders, not to make employees happy. Which is more profitable for the stock holders? No wonder the stock market is going up despite the loss of jobs.
17 posted on 10/04/2003 8:26:49 PM PDT by tinamina
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To: Archangelsk
Bump
18 posted on 10/04/2003 8:34:48 PM PDT by FR_addict
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To: Lael
Your Socialist mantra tagline is oh, so clever. Let me guess, you’re a Plagiarism major.

Be very worried about your inability to compete in the international marketplace.

But don’t dwell upon those high paid workers from India. Given your demonstrated ability to regurgitate socialist rhetoric; a parrot is more likely to replace you for the wages of stale crackers.

For the rest of us, those who carefully chose our vocation and who utilize critical thinking skills; we understand that wages are based upon the value an employee brings to an organization. Each day one should ask their self, is my employer better off by keeping me well paid, or is the employer better off by hiring someone else?
19 posted on 10/04/2003 9:26:20 PM PDT by OneLoyalAmerican (Write a wise saying and your name lives forever.)
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To: Lael
Your tag line is quite similar to mine. Coincidence?
20 posted on 10/04/2003 9:29:18 PM PDT by Elliott Jackalope (We send our kids to Iraq to fight for them, and they send our jobs to India. Now THAT'S gratitude!)
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