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Google sucked into RIAA/P2P fight
vnunet ^

Posted on 09/02/2003 9:34:50 AM PDT by chance33_98

Google sucked into RIAA/P2P fight

By Dinah Greek [02-09-2003] Search firm removes links to certain P2P sites following complaint from Kazaa creators

Popular search engine Google has been sucked into the ongoing legal battle between the Recording Industry of America (RIAA) and peer-to-peer sites (P2P). Following a court ruling in favour of the RIAA, Sharman Networks, the developers of the popular Kazaa P2P site, sent a letter to Google requesting that it remove links to certain sites.

Fifteen sites are thought to be in breach of the US Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA), and are said by Sharman Networks to be running unauthorised copies of its Kazaa P2P software.

The letter demanded that Google should "immediately remove or disable all access to the infringing material".

Google has now removed the URLs from its search listings.

In a statement posted at the foot of its search results, Google said: "In response to a complaint we received under the DMCA, we have removed eight result(s) from this page. If you wish, you may read the DMCA complaint for these removed results."

Google has also posted a link to the letter from Sharman.

It has listed the full URLs of the sites it has removed, of which all but three still worked when tested by vnunet.com.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Crime/Corruption; Extended News; Miscellaneous; Technical
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To: SauronOfMordor
One scratch and they're useless.

Mmmmm....not so much.

61 posted on 09/04/2003 7:42:31 PM PDT by Bloody Sam Roberts (®)
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To: Jack Wilson
I don't think a publisher would have any problem with that in theory.

Ahhh... but they do. In theory and in practice. And they have stated as much.

62 posted on 09/04/2003 7:44:19 PM PDT by Bloody Sam Roberts (®)
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To: Gumption
You got me on that. There are exceptions, like the lifetime muffler guarantee. But in general, you gotta admit when it comes to popular consumer items, nobody is expecting things to be indestructible. Craftsman tools fill a certain niche in the market and you pay a little more than for brand x. A music publisher could offer a similar guarantee for its cd's if it wanted to, but I expect you would have to pay a premium.
63 posted on 09/04/2003 7:44:46 PM PDT by Jack Wilson
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To: Jack Wilson
"These things will be filling landfills for centuries. "

They are already filling landfills. Didn't you get any AOL CDs in the mail?

"Plastic is durable"

There are only two kinds of plastic: Broken plastic and plastic that hasn't broken yet.

64 posted on 09/04/2003 7:45:58 PM PDT by Paladin2
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To: an amused spectator
I'll let you borrow my can of Troll-B-Gone™. I'm getting a little tired of it myself.
65 posted on 09/04/2003 7:48:16 PM PDT by Tench_Coxe
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To: Bloody Sam Roberts
It's the "intellectual property" that you are licensing.

'Course, my question implied the answer in a sneaky kinda way. But I think you may be confusing the licensing of computer software, where the buyer, or licensee, if you prefer, explicitly agrees to the licensing of the software (and from my experience with corporate software, he can order free of charge or copy multiple units of the media,) whereas a buyer of a CD doesn't agree to anything, explicitly or implicitly, as there is no legal notice other than the brief copyright statement anywhere on the media. If a copyright statement alone implied what you're saying, then that is all that would be needed on the copies of the corporate software too.

66 posted on 09/04/2003 7:48:48 PM PDT by Revolting cat! (Go ahead, make my day and re-state the obvious! Again!)
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To: devnull
How many of those sites are actually RIAA-owned honeypots put there just to entice you into giving them your IP and other info useful for suing you with later?
67 posted on 09/04/2003 7:48:54 PM PDT by FreedomCalls (It's the "Statue of Liberty," not the "Statue of Security.")
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To: chance33_98
OK, wait a minute. It sounds like they removed the links but still list the URL's. Is that what it says?
68 posted on 09/04/2003 7:49:32 PM PDT by Rocky
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To: an amused spectator
One of my grandchildren trashed a brand-new DVD from The Fellowship extended edition before I even viewed it.

Arrrggghh! You have my sympathies.

I thought I'd scored this past weekend when I found "The Two Towers" DVD for $14.99.

When I got it home my wife filled me in as to why it was so cheap. On the back of the box it says one of the features is "special 10 minute behind the scenes preview of the extended director's cut version".


69 posted on 09/04/2003 7:50:39 PM PDT by Bloody Sam Roberts (®)
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To: Jack Wilson
But it has the potential to wipe out entire industries (music/movies/games/book publishing) involving creative works.

Gutenberg's movable type wiped out the entire scribe industry. Was that bad? Were there more books in the world when each copy had to be handwritten or are there more now that they can be printed? Are more books bad?

70 posted on 09/04/2003 7:51:57 PM PDT by FreedomCalls (It's the "Statue of Liberty," not the "Statue of Security.")
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To: All
Government looks the other way as manufacturing and IT in this country are being destroyed. Yet the recording industry alone gets special laws, special treatment by the Justice Department, etc. Very curious.
71 posted on 09/04/2003 7:52:58 PM PDT by kms61
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To: Revolting cat!
But I think you may be confusing the licensing of computer software,

Perhaps...but I was putting my reply in terms that had been defined by Jack Wilson's statement, "When you buy a song or a movie, you are not really the new owner of that work; you are merely a licensee."

Essentially he is correct. The intellectual property or 'the work' is what you are paying the inflated price for. Certainly the materials cost very little and in the end...they unequivocally belong to the purchaser.

whereas a buyer of a CD doesn't agree to anything, explicitly or implicitly,

I've often wondered why the RIAA doesn't initiate some sort of EULA for the "software" on the product that their masters sell (Yes, they are nothing but p!$$ boys for the Big Record Labels). It sure would delineate things a bit better and put the pirates squarely in the wrong.

72 posted on 09/04/2003 8:04:55 PM PDT by Bloody Sam Roberts (®)
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To: Calpernia; Gumption; Paladin2
You can copy your music. Everyone in the United States pays a tax indirectly on ALL blank Media and recording equipment. The government has passed several pieces of legislation (Home Recording Act, the Millenium Recording Act, etc.) that require manufacturers and/or distributors of any digital recording equipment or media to pay a percentage-based tax.

trollWilson: "why do you need a backup?"

Check me if I'm wrong here, but Wilson is agin even making a backup copy of your own purchase. Must not have children. ;-)

One of my wife's favorite CDs had a bad biff-scratch on it. The copy I made played better than the original damaged one.

Horrors! :-)

73 posted on 09/04/2003 8:18:31 PM PDT by an amused spectator
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To: Bloody Sam Roberts
Anyone else see the irony in Kazaa complaining about copyright infringement? I saw it right off

Hey, where were you? I could have used some help out here.

74 posted on 09/04/2003 8:19:10 PM PDT by Jack Wilson
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To: Pan_Yans Wife
If this is legal, then why wouldn't it be legal to rent a DVD from Blockbuster and then copy it?

It's not as easy to copy a DVD yet. People have been renting VHS tapes from Blockbuster and copying them forever. The same difficulty that one has with a DVD is present with books.

My point is that the technology to easily make copies of DVDs, CDs, VHS tapes, books, etc. is here, now. Why aren't we doing it? For example , libraries should be planning to replace their paper copies with electronic versions. Why should we have 500,000 copies of Lying History scattered about the country in brick & mortar buildings, when one electronic version could be located on a server somewhere? The reason is that a copyright cartel is blocking informational progress, and the reason is all about money.

I'll give you an absolutely fabulous example of the organized informational thievery engaged in by the cartel: college textbooks. College students are paying hundreds of dollars for texts that could be accessed via computer, and chapters printed off as needed.

It's theft, pure and simple - on a gargantuan scale.

75 posted on 09/04/2003 8:36:13 PM PDT by an amused spectator
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To: Bloody Sam Roberts
Thanks. I got burned in the last round (The Fellowship of the Ring), but I'm older and wiser. ;-)

Many people I know are going for the regular version, and plan on getting the extended version too. Who says that DVD sales are dead?

Say, you're not against making backup copies of your own media, like this Jack Wilson RIAA troll, are you? It's a pretty extreme position.

76 posted on 09/04/2003 8:39:33 PM PDT by an amused spectator
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To: Tench_Coxe
I'll let you borrow my can of Troll-B-Gone™. I'm getting a little tired of it myself.

Thanx! I tried to use some earlier, but somebody reported my post as "abuse". ;-)

77 posted on 09/04/2003 8:47:19 PM PDT by an amused spectator
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To: an amused spectator
Interesting point about textbooks.

My first grader has one school textbook, that must be used on a daily basis. But, the school does not have a copy for 'at home' use. (Necessary for young children who NEVER remember to bring anything home.) The teacher just copies the pages, and sends five or six home at a time.

So, this is the same as your idea.

As for college textbooks, a great deal of the information that students are using is already on the computer, and they take courses online, too. The cost is more per credit hour, but it truly is convenient. Perhaps the universities could impliment this on a broader scale, but I still think the copyright holders would want everyone to pay the same price, be it an "electronic book" version, or a hardbound volume.

Would the market support paying the same price, for both? I don't know about that.
78 posted on 09/04/2003 8:48:27 PM PDT by Pan_Yans Wife ("Life isn't fair. It's fairer than death, is all.")
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To: FreedomCalls
Gutenberg's movable type wiped out the entire scribe industry. Was that bad? Were there more books in the world when each copy had to be handwritten or are there more now that they can be printed? Are more books bad?

Exactly. We are in an information revolution, and an information cartel is attempting to empty our pockets for the "privilege" of derailing said revolution.

Look at the people that sued this place. Their information is available through Infotrac and various other public library Net portals, but it's not complete, and there's no way to ascertain that it's not complete, unless you happen to know it.

79 posted on 09/04/2003 8:53:55 PM PDT by an amused spectator
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To: Pan_Yans Wife
Would the market support paying the same price, for both? I don't know about that.

I don't have a problem with paying for information (I raided my local used bookstore for my own selfish purposes last week), but I object to the outright highway robbery being practiced by the information cartel.

80 posted on 09/04/2003 8:56:08 PM PDT by an amused spectator
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