Dr. James Dobson: "We're Not Going To The Back of The Bus"

FoxNews

[Happy2BMe]

Dr. James Dobson, a well-known and respected national Christian leader in speaking at a rally in front of the Alabama Courthouse containing the disputed monument of the Ten Commandments compared the ongoing struggle with that of the Black equal rights movement of the 1950's.

Dr. Dobson described the irony of how in 1955 when Rosa Parks refused to "Go to the back of the bus." by racially-driven bigots sparked a national equal rights movment and said that another national "movement" was now underway to protect the rights of Christians.

Dr. Dobson declared, "We are not going to the back of the bus!" in alluding to a growing consensus of Christian-Americans who would no longer tolerate being treated as citizens with lesser rights.

[viaveritasvita]

>>"May I please ask you again . . What written law has Judge Moore violated?"<<


Of course, that is the bottom line. But you'll damage your vocal cords asking this question over and over again to the intellectual spinners.

Judge Moore has not violated any law. (I understand that he has violated a ruling to remove the Commandments.)

[viaveritasvita]

>>"...[those who] harbor a disingenuous motive to avoid the relevant...[are] well represented in the pop media [and have] framed this case as an insurrection led by a religious zealot and his gaggle of street preachers, thus depreciating its legal significance in order to avoid substantive and instructive discussion about our Constitution."<<


OH HOW I WISH I'D SAID THAT! Fan of the Federalist, too.

[viaveritasvita]

As long as the essentials are there, I'd say that sometimes so-called "squabbles" are just honest differences between humans. Sometimes, they are just healthy debate and interesting discussion. They can also serve as reminders, as Christians are to do with each other. I also say this with the assumption that we are talking about differences among Christians and not between Christians and those who call themselves Christians.

There are many who say "Lord, Lord." But He never knew them.

[viaveritasvita]

>>"talibornagain hogwash"<<


You seem to be bright enough to make finer distinctions than you're making. Lumping all religions into one is a mistake that has eternal consequences. One of the world's religions is right; it is incumbent upon you to figure out which one. May I suggest some research into Christianity with an open-mind? Bring all your questions and skepticism; Christianity withstands them. There are important differences between Christianity and Islam (and all other religions); I urge you to check them out.

Your statement is highly inflammatory and is insulting.

[viaveritasvita]

Is the post I'm replying to acceptable to you?

[viaveritasvita]

>>"I have never understood how people who claim not to believe in the God of the Bible get so angry with Him."<<


I think it was Luther who said that those who were angry with God were closer to Him than those who were indifferent. I know 'cuz I've been there. May God's work continue in RobPaul.

[viaveritasvita]

>>"Ronald Reagan once said these prophetic words:
'You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will preserve for our children this last best hope of man on earth or we will sentence them to take the first step into a thousand years of darkness.'"<<


Thank you for posting this quote!

[viaveritasvita]

>>"Before you continue to make a complete a** of yourself, let me recommend 2 books to get you up to speed...."<<


May I add Lee Stroebel's The Case For Christ?

[tame]

May I add Lee Stroebel's The Case For Christ?

Sounds good to me :o)

[PleaseNoMore]

I have followed Sekulow's cases for years. I have always felt that he was a tremendous asset to the legal profession and to the Christian faith.

[CyberCowboy777]

To be factual - they all ready were.

In Israel where Jesus and the apostles lived.

[Robert_Paulson2]

One of the world's religions is right; it is incumbent upon you to figure out which one.

---

and which one would you say is IT?

[tame]

Let us also add, last but most, the Bible. Read it, meditate on it, shape your views around it.

[viaveritasvita]

>>"But if folks think removing this "stone" in any way reflects on our Almighty God's sovereignty or America's eternal destiny...."<<

Nothing in creation overrides God's sovereignty and I don't believe this issue is about God's sovereignty. A reading of the OT and the history of Israel will show that removing God and His Word does indeed have consequences to a nation. Your use of the words "our Almighty God" is puzzling given your hostility toward His Word and Christians in general....?


>>"Moore and his marble do not a Savior make...."<<

I agree. Help me out here: Have people been saying this??


>>"...asking a Judge to obey the law... whether he agrees with it or not."<<

Which law has Judge Moore disobeyed? Are you referring to the ruling that he remove the Commandments?


>>"God can set up His Own MONUMENTS... without our insisting on using government money, property or employees to do so."<<

God in His wisdom has decided to work thro His people (don't ask me why -- it's a question I'm dying to ask Him!). It is quite possible that God is working thro Judge Moore to set up this monument -- maybe either the nation or God's people are being tested in some way. God ordained government for His purposes; it is humans who have twisted that to exclude Him. For an interesting and (I hope) good correlation, please studying the effects of Israel's insistence on having kings.


>>"Judge Moore did the wrong thing. He knew it. And to almost a man each a committed bible believing Christian, and EVERY one of his fellow supremes KNOWS he did this on purpose for poltical purposes... and that it is WRONG... and that is why he is OUT the door, and off the bench."<<

Most of the Christians reading this will no doubt think it's a God thing, but as I was reading this paragraph the Christian radio news reported some 70% of Christians agree with and support Moore! Every single Christian I know personally agrees with and supports Moore. IF he's doing this for political purposes, I would be disappointed. But I submit that the leftie/atheists want you to believe that. ALTHO, even if it's politically motivated, God is capable and indeed does work everything for His good purposes (“We know that God causes all things to work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose.” Romans 8:28)


>>"...incarcerated before or after one of his crazed followers, whipped into a frenzy by the likes of keyes, falwell, crouch, kennedy or b. hinn... goes into a tongues speaking fit and pulls an "islamakazi" act in the name of Jesus....and then watch folks call him a holy martyr."<<


(At the risk of starting a "squabble" amongst Christians, I'm truly sorry you placed Crouch and Hinn on the same level with Keyes, Falwell and Kennedy!!) A follower of Judge Moore would not be considered a martyr for the faith. Had you said "a crazed follower of Jesus Christ," I might agree with calling him a holy martyr (I'm assuming from the little I've read that you think all followers of Jesus Christ are "crazed" no matter how reasoned or honorable they may be). (Also, I refer you to Voice of the Martyrs website, which I don't have on hand.)

Again I urge you to do your homework; some people who claim to be Christians are not. And, again, it is insulting in the extreme to be compared to the Islamist martyrs.

<><

[Robert_Paulson2]

"the Way the Truth and the Life" is NOT a rock installed by a populist judge trying to exploit folk's religious persuasions in the bible belt. HE is a person, not a list of rules...

---

Regarding civil law: Christians are NOT exempt from laws they don't agree with. It is wise to consider you must obey the law or pay the consequences... civil disobedience is fine, if you are willing to face the authorities on it.

"Obey the civil authorities" was actually a NEW testament command that the followers of Jesus obeyed, even though it resulted in turning them to lion food, or fuel for the pyres in the colliseum.

Perhaps the Judge and his followers should consider a new strategy... obedience like Jesus. Jesus was obedient to the point of death wasn't he? So a little jail time, for "civil disobedience" should be tolerable, if it makes your point.

The bottom line is you don't get to pick and choose what laws you will or will not obey... and in this nation, "under GOD" we are not allowed to promote ONE faith over another in publicly owned buildings. THAT is the law. Like it or lump it.

This is really not about the whims of YOUR religious extremiust freinds to me, as much as it is about them thinking they don't have to follow the rules because they are the "chosen".

Muslim jihadis think they are "chosen" and do all kinds of TERRIBLE things in the name of a God who "speaks" to them too.

They think they are special.

They are not. The soul that sinneth shall die... and to date the death rate has been pretty much 100 percent.

Religious law and secular law do not mix well. And listening to the religiounists around here is eerily similar to the translated ramblings of one osami ben laden... "God will make you pay..." and such.

I would prefer to "keep your particular faith, out of MY court building" As far as I am concerned... because yours is no better than anyone else's. God will judge at that day and no debate will be going on... as to who is right and who is wrong.

Nowhere in scripture are we told to install amended, reordered and redacted copies of God's laws to the Children of Israel in our court buildings.

It is reasonable to assume that God would prefer to see the commandments posted in the whopping 98 percent of churches that don't currently have them in place in their own buildings. After you get 90 percent coverage in YOUR buildings first, then we can talk about the need for God and His amended ten laws, "public's" buildings.

At this point in time, only 2 percent of churches have a display of the commandments and 100 percent of Saints, including the pastors fail to keep them...

the arguing however is pointless... the statue has been moved, right?

and the desire to institute state and religion, is not going to happen...

[Robert_Paulson2]

"our Almighty God" is puzzling given your hostility toward His Word and Christians in general

---

that's because you falsely assume that anyone that doesn't agree with you is NOT a Christian or a believer...

typical of your side on this matter,
and consider for a moment that you might also be WRONG...
not all christians believe in the joining of church and state... and indeed a significant portion of us think it dangerous, immoral and displeasing to God...

Some of the founders believed that way.
Some of them were christians.
Some of us believe it today.

Jesus didn't die to make us build stone statues in court buildings.
And the courts are no place to preach or expand upon religious and moral dogma, except as it applies to actual court cases where civil law has been broken..

there IS a seperation between church/religion and STATE. and that is the way it is... and I believe based on the writings of the founders and the apostles... that is the way it needs to STAY.

You've ignored the quotes on this side of the issue while ranting to moderators about how you are offended... sorry you are offended... but YOUR concept of the whole issue of governance and faith is opposite mine.

and I will not change what I know. Religion and Government are a deadly mix.. always have been... and we need to keep them separate... you free to believe it your way... and me free to believe it mine.

Your attitude and words only go to emphasize WHY religionists MUST be held back from their tendency to abuse governmental power to direct the lives of others according to the dictates of THEIR religious convictions...

Judge Moore has done nothing good in this act of his, in my opinion and done only harm to the name of Christ and the freedome the Church has historically enjoyed in this land. Whenever religion and state join, BOTH lose their liberty... and the founders were wise to make sure NEITHER were allowed to tread on each other's turf.

The courts... are the State's turf. The church grounds and the believers homes are THEIRS... keep em separated, or lose them both.

[viaveritasvita]

I meant to include you in my post 354. I'm scrambling to keep up here! At some point, I'm going to have to bow out -- I ain't gettin' any younger! We seem to be in agreement for the most part (especially about the grace of God and that we are not justified by the law), so just a couple of things...


>>"My question to you is, how are you doing? Kept them all? Even the one where Jesus said that if you call a person an "empty head" you're guilty of murder?"<<

I'm struggling along like any other Christian. I have, in fact, broken ALL of the 10 Commandments and some of the other major principles, too. Most of that occurred before I was a Christian (my most recent disobedience was accepting a job that required me to work on Sabbath -- which I believe is Sat). I believe there is something holy in the struggle and that God knows my heart (that I struggle to keep His Commandments, I struggle against evil). God honors my struggle and my obedience. Whether I keep them inadequately or not, Jesus has taken my sin and made atonement for me. Does this mean I can continue to break His Commandments (i.e. sin)? Does this mean that I can continue in my old ways, relying on Jesus' work to cover me? Does this mean I can expect God to honor or bless me when I sin without repenting? Does this mean I'm exempt from the consequences of my sin? In the words of our friend in Christ, Paul, CERTAINLY NOT!!!


>>"But Jesus also said that the two greatest commandments, the two that are the sum the entire Law of Moses, are 'love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength, and love your neighbor as yourself.'"<<

The "greatest," not the "only."


I think it's a mistake to focus totally on the grace/mercy/love part of God's nature; He is equally a God of justice and holiness.

The 10 Commandments bring people to an understanding of who and what they are in the eyes of a Holy God.

Jesus attacked the misapplication of the law; religious leaders of His day (Pharisees, et al) kept the law for the wrong reasons. Jesus took away the CURSE of the law (sorry don't know scripture cite off-hand); He didn't come to override the law.

Of course, being known on FR as viaveritasvita, I believe that Jesus Christ is the way, the truth, and the life!

1 John 5:3 "For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome."

P.S. TO ALL CHRISTIANS: Can someone help me find the scripture that talks about....well, something about posting the law or commandments on our doorposts (my words -- UGH!)

<><

[viaveritasvita]

>>"Were early Christians living in Rome breaking the law by meeting secretly in the catacombs?"<<

Yes, they were breaking the law of Rome (assuming there was a law that said Christians could not assemble and worship Christ).


>>"Were those fleeing religious persecution from the Church of England breaking the law by refusing to bow down it?"<<

Yes.


>>"If so, were they disobedient to God?"<<

No. Obedience to God comes before obedience to ANY other authority.

<><

[tame]

Can someone help me find the scripture that talks about....well, something about posting the law or commandments on our doorposts (my words -- UGH!)

Deuteronomy 11:20.

[viaveritasvita]

>>"and which one would you say is IT?"<<


Christianity (as I'm sure you've guessed). How about you?