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Getting a glimpse at SCO's evidence
CNET news.com ^ | August 19, 2003 | Lisa M. Bowman

Posted on 08/19/2003 7:39:56 AM PDT by Joe Bonforte

LAS VEGAS--When SCO Group first filed its lawsuit against IBM in March, critics characterized the move as the last gasp of an ailing company hoping to strike a series of lucrative licensing deals.

Since then the company has come out swinging even harder, bashing its detractors, standing by its allegations, and most recently, posting a profit that SCO said would allow it to continue its aggressive intellectual property fight.

At the SCO Forum here Monday, the company pulled out its latest weapon: lines and lines of disputed code that were allegedly copied from SCO's Unix into IBM's version of Linux. The company claims that IBM illegally copied Unix code into its version of Linux, and it's warning Linux customers that they may be violating copyright by using the operating system without paying SCO. It's also recently announced a new licensing plan that would require Linux customers to pay between $199 and $699 per computer.

In a quiet conference room tucked into the conference center at the MGM Grand, SCO offered customers, partners and the merely curious the chance to view the code for themselves, as long as they signed a nondisclosure agreement.

Companies involved in litigation traditionally keep such information under wraps in order not to tip their legal hand, but SCO said it decided to display the code because its critics were charging that it didn't have a case.

"Given the nature of this case and that there may be a significant period of time before it's resolved and that people were clamoring to see it, we decided to show a few pieces of evidence," said Chris Sontag, senior vice president of the SCOsource unit, which is charged with protecting SCO's Unix-related intellectual property.

As of the end of the day on Monday, more than 150 people had seen the code presentation, which the company said includes a small portion of the infringing code it has found so far. Sontag said the company has uncovered more than a million lines of copied code in Linux, with the help of pattern recognition experts.

A compelling case?
According to those who viewed the code at SCO Forum, company representatives showed off several categories of code that allegedly infringed its copyrights, including some lines that appeared to be directly copied, some that were derivative works and some that were obfuscated, such as code from which legal disclaimers had been removed. (This reporter declined to sign the nondisclosure agreement required to attend the special sessions where the companies showed off a special side-by-side comparison of the code, opting instead to gather reactions from people who saw the presentation.)

After viewing the code, Don Price, general manager of Price Data Systems, said he was surprised at the volume that was allegedly copied. "It's compelling," he said. "Some people were either extremely sloppy, or copied and thought no one would go after them."

Neil Abraham, with SCO reseller Kerridge Computer, said SCO made the right decision to pursue IBM. "I think they've got a very firm case," he said, after looking at the code. "It's not just one line. It's huge chunks."

Bob Ungetti, of Raven Technologies, who was milling about waiting to get into a room where the code was being shown off, said he wanted to see the code because his customers have been asking him about the suit. "I want to see the code myself just to substantiate the claims SCO is making, so when I talk to my customers about the credibility of the lawsuit, I can say I saw it for myself," said Ungetti, whose company is a reseller for SCO. "If they're interested in using Linux, they're concerned they may be adversely affected; my SCO customers are concerned that if the company loses the lawsuit, it may be out of business."

Ungetti said a keynote address on Monday morning had already convinced him that SCO had a pretty solid case. During a speech, SCO representatives showed a few slides containing the allegedly infringing code, offering attendees a taste of what they could see if they signed the nondisclosure agreement.

"The spelling errors and comments (copied into the code) are the real kicker. To me, that's the nail in the coffin," Ungetti said.

Many attendees of the conference are longtime SCO fans, so convincing them that the company has a case by showing them the code probably wasn't too tough. However, at least one attendee was appalled by SCO's decision to sue IBM. The man, an exhibitor on the show floor who asked that his name not be used, said that SCO's hands aren't clean either, because the company has probably taken code from other sources and incorporated it into its products. "It looks to me like there's been a lot of cross-pollination" between Unix and Linux, said the attendee, who jokingly called SCO's legal saga "As the Stomach Turns."

Legal experts agreed that SCO faces a challenge of proving that it has the original rights to the code--a task that could prove especially daunting because of a special license popular among makers of free and open-source software known as the GNU Public License, or GPL. The GPL requires companies that incorporate code into their product to share their changes. In its response to SCO's legal filing, IBM claims that SCO can't assert claims to the disputed code because it was originally covered under the GPL.

"Even if there is literal copying, you'll have to say, 'What's the source of the code?'" said Stuart Meyer, a partner with Fenwick & West, who is not involved in the case.

SCO has denied that the disputed code is covered by the GPL. An attorney for the company said Monday that even if it were, federal copyright laws protecting the company's intellectual property would trump the free software license, an argument that could form the crux of the case should it go to trial.


TOPICS: Miscellaneous; Technical
KEYWORDS: copyright; lawsuit; linux; sco
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To: Joe Bonforte
But I also think that from a legal standpoint, if they can prove massive copying of their intellectual property into Linux, then Linux users are in deep trouble, since they will have to bear the responsibility for using that copyrighted code.

Nope. Both SCO and Caldera (who they bought) have distributed this code under the GPL license for years now. Will SCO sue themselves now? I hope so.
81 posted on 08/19/2003 10:49:48 AM PDT by adam_az
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To: Liberal Classic
If SCO argues the GPL is invalid, it's not such a stretch to argue the same for the BSD license. Likewise, it seems to me that SCO's position is they own all UNIX implementations, not just the UNIX version 6, version 7, and SVR4, up to and including Linux and open source BSD. I believe that SCO is gambling on the ignorance of the judiciary on computer technology, and it's not an unsafe bet.

No, AT&T already tried that, against BSD. They lost, big time. Interestingly enough, a major reason was because AT&T was found to have copied significant amount of BSD code. I don't know all the details, but you can find more info at:

http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/who/dmr/bsdi/930303.ruling.txt

SCO's claim about the invalidity of the GPL is hogwash. A first-year law student could demolish it. Copyright law grants the right to make a single copy in the absence of permission by the copyright holder. But, the copyright holder can grant whatever permission they want.

For instance, Microsoft grants OEM's the right to make many copies of Windows for installation on new computers. If the GPL violates copyright law for this reason, then many other commonly-accepted practices are also illegal.

82 posted on 08/19/2003 10:50:26 AM PDT by justlurking
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To: Norman Conquest
Perhaps you ought to read Mr. Perens' article, linked above. The facts don't support your conclusion.
83 posted on 08/19/2003 10:53:02 AM PDT by dwollmann
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To: justlurking
One of the two excerpts is in Kernighan aand Ritchie's C book. Hayzoos Marimba...

I wonder if SCO had any clue that their little love-in for their true believers would go that ugly on 'em? I think it's past time for them to hire someone who can read code, and someone who can drive Google... skills they seem to be lacking.

d.o.l.

Criminal Number 18F

84 posted on 08/19/2003 11:02:58 AM PDT by Criminal Number 18F
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To: HiTech RedNeck
The "munitions list" argument is not one I've heard before. It is interesting because only a few decades ago it would have held water quite well. Today, however, UNIX source licenses have been sold all over the world, and UNIX programming and kernel design are likewise taught in universities worldwide. Putting UNIX back on the munitions list wouldn't fly today, because every desktop sold contains a protected memory time-sharing operating system -- thanks largely to Microsoft. Since, among other things China is developing her own Intel clone chip, it's too late for personal computers and the software that drives them to be put under export control.

When SCO first made the complaint against IBM, I thought it was possible they had a case. I am not privy to business parternship agreements made since AT&T Unix System Labs first started selling source licenses. I felt it was plausable that IBM over stepped its bounds when it came to some of its intellectual property.

However, SCO's actions since then have changed my opinion. I have never, ever seen a company move with such reckless abandon when an important lawsuit is on the line. Even when the outcome is virtually assured, companies are cautious in the extreme when referring to a potential outcome. There are very good reasons for this not the least of which is federal law.

After doing some light reading, I believe that SCO may have comitted deceptive trade practices when it announced that various commercial companies and governmental agencies owed them per Linux install. I have never in my years in the computer industry seen a company demand license fees relating to a court case that had not yet been decided. I am not a trade attorney, but from my limited understanding of federal deceptive trade practices law as well as similar state laws prohibit causes of confustion or misundertanding as to ownership or affiliation of a product, misleading statements concerning prices and fees, as well as disparaging statements directed towards compeditors. Under federal law, it is not necessary to prove actual deception, only that a company had the capacity to deceive others with regards to the business activities of others.

Without judicial backing, I think that SCO by demanding payment from various parties and announcing ownership of Linux as theirs without proof has uncautiously opened themselves up to legal action, even if in the end IBM is orderd to pay fines and Linux is ordered to remove files with SCO code.

Speaking without the facts proved in a court of law is very reckless of them. I thought that they had a chance when they had only filed their complaint against IBM. But once they started announcing press releases that contained claims of ownership and a large installed base of fees, I knew something had to be wrong. No company in its right mind makes announcements such as these. I don't care how cut and dried the facts of the case may be, making such statements before they are proved is extrememly dangerous -- which is why no other company I have seen has made such wide-sweeping claims.

85 posted on 08/19/2003 11:07:17 AM PDT by Liberal Classic (Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentis telum est.)
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To: justlurking
No, AT&T already tried that, against BSD. They lost, big time. Interestingly enough, a major reason was because AT&T was found to have copied significant amount of BSD code. I don't know all the details, but you can find more info at:

Furthermore, GNU Hurd was tied up in lawsuits for a time, shortly before the emergence of Linux. Stallman himself has been rumored to have whined and complained that while he was tied up in court, people were installing Linux.

The BSD and Hurd suits are one of the reasons why I believe SCO is five to ten years too late to raise the question of "unauthorized UNIX implementations."

86 posted on 08/19/2003 11:09:53 AM PDT by Liberal Classic (Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentis telum est.)
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To: justlurking
OK, the lwn link is accessible now. I'm cornfused... is this code part of BSD? The lwn article says that Caldera released it, not under BSD itself, but under a BSD-style license, which is totally free but also requires that copyright credit be given to Caldera. If this is so and Linux didn't give this copyright credit, then it could be in trouble for this one after all.
87 posted on 08/19/2003 11:11:18 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck
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To: HiTech RedNeck
Yes, the code was already in BSD. I believe that Caldera copied it from BSD, then released it again under the BSD license.

Under your interpretation, I would expect a consent agreement to restore the copyright notice (which is similar to what happened between BSD and USL/AT&T). But, it hardly supports SCO's claims of misappropriation of proprietary code.

88 posted on 08/19/2003 11:21:49 AM PDT by justlurking
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To: Criminal Number 18F
Wow - two great worlds intersect - /. and FR!
89 posted on 08/19/2003 11:26:06 AM PDT by NCjim
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To: Charles H. (The_r0nin)
Charles,

When push comes to shove nearly EVERY NON COMPETE CLAUSE is unenforceable... which effectively is what their NDA is by saying things like you can't work on similar code every if you look at this....

The only way anyone can enforce a non compete clause is if, and only if they compensate you to stay on the sidelines.

If I look say at SCO's TCP stack source code after signing their NDA then I can't work on TCP stacks anywhere... well that is patently unenforceable, courts have already ruled on such things. No company can prevent an individual from working or plying their trade in a manner or in a field they are trained to do. This section of the NDA effectively is a "non compete" and unless SCO can show they compensated you while you worked directly for them at rates far and above standard and customary for your services, or that they paid you lump sum or otherwise to sit on the sidelines, they cannot enforce such non compete nonsense.

Its purely intimidation, not legally enforceable.
90 posted on 08/19/2003 11:29:17 AM PDT by HamiltonJay
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To: Nick Danger
/*
* Copyright (c) 1986 Regents of the University of California.
* All rights reserved. The Berkeley software License Agreement
* specifies the terms and conditions for redistribution.
*
* @(#)subr_rmap.c 1.2 (2.11BSD GTE) 12/24/92
- snip -
/*
* Allocate 'size' units from the given map. Return the base of the
* allocated space. In a map, the addresses are increasing and the
* list is terminated by a 0 size.
*
* Algorithm is first-fit.
*/

Is a Berkeley license included in Linux? This is a broader issue than just this piece of code, it applies to anything from Linux that was borrowed from BSD.

91 posted on 08/19/2003 11:29:18 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck
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To: HiTech RedNeck
Is a Berkeley license included in Linux?

Yes, it is. Those parts of Linux that were taken from BSD are supposed to include a notice acknowledging the source (it's a condition of the license).

The BSD license is less restrictive than the GPL: it doesn't require redistribution in source form. That's why you will find it in many operating systems, including Windows. The TCP/IP networking code is a common example.

92 posted on 08/19/2003 11:32:37 AM PDT by justlurking
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To: HiTech RedNeck
$ uname -r
2.4.20-gentoo-r6

$ find . -name \*.[ch] | xargs egrep -il \ > 'Copyright \(c\) [0-9]+(, *[0-9]+)* (The )?Regents of the University of California'
./drivers/net/bsd_comp.c
./drivers/net/slhc.c
./drivers/char/tpqic02.c
./drivers/isdn/isdn_bsdcomp.c
./include/net/slhc_vj.h
./include/linux/quota.h

93 posted on 08/19/2003 11:45:11 AM PDT by dwollmann
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To: justlurking
And now the comments have been found in a 1984 posting to Usenet...

Is that all it takes to permanently steal code these days? Just have some rogue post it on Usenet, and *BAM*, no longer yours.

94 posted on 08/19/2003 12:26:23 PM PDT by Golden Eagle
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To: justlurking
This is from 1979. I'm not clear on the origin of the code referenced above....

You're not? Well that is the question, I believe, down to the root, and were they authorized to do that. If it was a previous licensee, how do you know they were allowed?

It actually makes sense that if SCO was willing to show any portion of their evidence in public, it might be something that was already 'public', even if illegally. Maybe that's giving SCO more benefit of the doubt than they deserve, but I've certainly not seen any of this frantic evidence gathering by these partisans as proof of anything yet.

95 posted on 08/19/2003 12:33:24 PM PDT by Golden Eagle
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To: Golden Eagle
Is that all it takes to permanently steal code these days? Just have some rogue post it on Usenet, and *BAM*, no longer yours.

Look at the date. It predates SCO Unix. SCO can't claim prior art afterwards.

96 posted on 08/19/2003 12:52:43 PM PDT by justlurking
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To: Golden Eagle
Well that is the question, I believe, down to the root, and were they authorized to do that. If it was a previous licensee, how do you know they were allowed?

All you have to do is follow some of the links. It provides information about the origin. At the time I posted that comment, I didn't know and hadn't yet found it.

The important part is the date: 1979. It predates SCO Unix, and invalidates their claim of prior art.

97 posted on 08/19/2003 12:54:28 PM PDT by justlurking
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To: justlurking
I've heard analysts (not SCO) say in some cases the codebase could go back "30" years, and 79 wasn't that far back.

Sorry, I'm not going to follow your links if you don't even know what they say yourself, which you don't seem to.

What is the origin, and how can it positively broken from Sys V which predates Unix 7?
98 posted on 08/19/2003 1:13:56 PM PDT by Golden Eagle
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To: Charles H. (The_r0nin)
I believe it. Anyone who would sign such an NDA, if your characterization is truly accurate (and I take your word for it) is an idiot.

I find the SCO executive staff beneath contempt.

99 posted on 08/19/2003 1:34:52 PM PDT by RightOnline
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To: Golden Eagle
Sorry, I'm not going to follow your links if you don't even know what they say yourself, which you don't seem to.

Most of the links I posted early in the thread were to archives of source code -- the story was developing fast and I was trying to provide info to people following this thread. I subsequently posted links to articles that summarized the relevance and provide the information that you were asking for.

If you don't want to take the time to read them, then don't waste my time. Personally, I think the problem is that you are afraid of what you will find -- irrefutable proof that SCO's claims are bogus.

If you want to stick your head in the sand, please do so. But be sure to take a deep breath first, as you may have to stay there for a while.

100 posted on 08/19/2003 1:39:11 PM PDT by justlurking
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