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Ala. AG Won't Help Judge in Federal Fight
AP via Atlanta Journal-Constitution ^ | August 15, 2003 | Bob Johnson

Posted on 08/15/2003 2:30:08 PM PDT by Lurking Libertarian

Ala. AG Won't Help Judge in Federal Fight By BOB JOHNSON Associated Press Writer

MONTGOMERY, Ala. (AP)--The attorney general and Alabama Supreme Court associate justices are distancing themselves from the state's chief justice, who has pledged to defy a federal court order to remove a Ten Commandments monument from the state's judicial building.

Chief Justice Roy Moore said Thursday he had ``no intention'' of obeying the order to remove the monument from the building, where he moved it in the middle of the night in 2001. He has said that the Ten Commandments represent the moral foundation of American law.

Attorney General Bill Pryor said Thursday he would refuse to help Moore violate the court order, which could result in contempt fines of about $5,000 a day against the state. He declined to say what specific action he would take.

At the same time, Moore's colleagues on the state Supreme Court met to discuss whether they can invoke a state law that lets a majority of the nine justices overrule an administrative action by the chief justice.

Senior Associate Justice Gorman Houston said the justices ``will take whatever steps are necessary'' to make certain that the state of doesn't have to pay fines.

But the justices took no immediate action as Moore prepared to file his initial pleading Friday with the U.S. Supreme Court to stop any removal of the monument.

Meanwhile, attorneys suing to remove the monument filed a complaint Thursday with the Alabama Judicial Inquiry Commission accusing Moore of violating judicial ethics by refusing to obey a court order.

Supporters cheered Moore's claim that a federal court doesn't have the legal authority to make a state judge remove the monument.

``It's so rare to find someone who would make a stand,'' said Rick Scarborough, president of Vision America, a national association of churches and pastors who have supported Moore.

Pryor said he personally believes the Old Testament laws can be displayed legally but that doesn't change his responsibility as attorney general.

``I have a duty to obey all orders of courts even when I disagree with those orders,'' Pryor said in a statement.

Moore's declaration came six days before the courts' Aug. 20 deadline for the 5,300-pound granite monument to be removed from the judicial building rotunda, where it is in clear sight of visitors coming in the main entrance.

With Christian groups planning several rallies over the next week to show support of the monument, the executive director of Americans United for Separation of Church and State, Barry Lynn, accused Moore of creating a circus out of the Ten Commandments issue.

``If Judge Moore can't in good conscience comply with a lawful federal court order, he ought to resign,'' Lynn said.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Front Page News; US: Alabama
KEYWORDS: billpryor; davidcosborne; judgemoore; pryor; roymoore; tencommandments
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To: Torie
The "end game" is we see if the U.S. Government has the AUDACITY to put a State Supreme Court Chief Justice in JAIL for violating an ILLEGAL ORDER..... If this happens then we will certainly have the "National Media" attention.. this is NOT getting the coverage it deserves..
81 posted on 08/17/2003 9:20:48 AM PDT by davidosborne (www.davidosborne.net)
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To: MissAmericanPie
I DOUBT that will happen... Judge Moore is DEFENDING the STATE's rights.... I just wish we had Judge Moore in FLORIDA !!!
82 posted on 08/17/2003 9:22:19 AM PDT by davidosborne (www.davidosborne.net)
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To: MissAmericanPie
I am disapointed to see the AG take this approach.. he has placed the SPIRIT of the LAW... BELOW the LETTER of the LAW which is EXACTLY what our FOUNDING FATHERS not to mention scripture cautions us against doing....... Judge Moore is EXACTLY RIGHT and ON TARGET.... anyone who Can't see this does not deserve to hold public office in THIS COUNTRY
83 posted on 08/17/2003 9:26:43 AM PDT by davidosborne (www.davidosborne.net)
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To: davidosborne
Moore would be about the only one defending states rights. Pryor and the Alabama Court seem to think they work for Washington D.C.

If the citizens of Alabama can't expect their attorney general and state judges to stand up against D.C. thugery then they should give them the boot.

If the citizens of every state would take control of their state houses and demand protection from Federal abuse alot of these communist agendas would be shot in the foot.
84 posted on 08/17/2003 9:29:24 AM PDT by MissAmericanPie
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To: davidosborne
I am disapointed to see the AG take this approach..

Pryor has been nominated by Bush for a federal judgeship - apparently there is no way in hell he would risk that opportunity by standing up for Judge Moore. Which makes me less inclined to support his nomination. Apparently federalism is fine and dandy unless it undermines your own personal power - which is exactly what got us into this mess in the first place - usurpation.

85 posted on 08/17/2003 10:07:13 AM PDT by dirtboy (Arnold's positions are like the alien in Predator - you can't see them but you know they're lethal)
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To: dirtboy
Which makes me less inclined to support his nomination.

AGREED...

86 posted on 08/17/2003 10:25:46 AM PDT by davidosborne (www.davidosborne.net)
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To: davidosborne
The "end game" is we see if the U.S. Government has the AUDACITY to put a State Supreme Court Chief Justice in JAIL for violating an ILLEGAL ORDER

Isn't the problem here deciding how we are to decide the legality of court orders?

Do you really want to live in a country where each of us decides for ourselves what laws and orders we wish to obey and which we wish to ignore?

87 posted on 08/17/2003 10:30:39 AM PDT by Scenic Sounds (All roads lead to reality. That's why I smile.)
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To: jwalsh07
"Thomas Jefferson, as a state legislator, voted for laws respecting the establishement of religion."

EXCUSE ME?

88 posted on 08/17/2003 11:11:31 AM PDT by Luis Gonzalez (I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together)
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To: dirtboy
This is the pertinent section of the Constitution of the State of Alabama:

SECTION 3

Religious freedom.

That no religion shall be established by law; that no preference shall be given by law to any religious sect, society, denomination, or mode of worship; that no one shall be compelled by law to attend any place of worship; nor to pay any tithes, taxes, or other rate for building or repairing any place of worship, or for maintaining any minister or ministry; that no religious test shall be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under this state; and that the civil rights, privileges, and capacities of any citizen shall not be in any manner affected by his religious principles.

This is Moore's statement as to his reasons for putting the monument in the Rotunda"

""The monument serves to remind the appellate courts and judges of the circuit and district courts of this state and members of the bar who appear before them as well as the people of Alabama who visit the Alabama Judicial Building of the truth stated in the preamble of the Alabama Constitution that in order to establish justice we must invoke 'the favor and guidance of Almighty God,' "

The Court has an issue with the intent of the Judge, not with the monument. I have an issue with the Judge using his position as an elected official to initiate this situation without a mandate from the State Legislature.

The combination of Moore's statement, and the placement of the monument depicting the tenets of Christianity has the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court of Alabama, in extra-judicial manner, defining God as the God of Judeo-Christian beliefs, in violation of the State's Constitution.

89 posted on 08/17/2003 11:24:58 AM PDT by Luis Gonzalez (I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together)
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To: Lurking Libertarian
Another example of legal=lethal and has nothing to do with lawful. God bless Chief Justice Moore.
90 posted on 08/17/2003 11:29:26 AM PDT by ApesForEvolution ("The only way evil triumphs is if good men do nothing" E. Burke)
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To: Scenic Sounds
Isn't the problem here deciding how we are to decide the legality of court orders?

Not at all.. it is about the MORAL foundation of the laws themselves.... Our Nations foundation is ... ANYONE who holds an office in this Nation must swear an OATH to SUPPORT and DEFEND the Constitution of the United States... If you are ordered to VIOLATE your OATH, you MUST REFUSE the order and be true to YOUR OATH...

Do you really want to live in a country where each of us decides for ourselves what laws and orders we wish to obey and which we wish to ignore?

That is NOT the issue here... Judge MOORE is correct in rufusing an ORDER that would cause him to VIOLATE the OATH of his office... ANYONE who violates his/her oath will not be able to use the excuse that "I was told too..."

91 posted on 08/17/2003 5:37:05 PM PDT by davidosborne (www.davidosborne.net)
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To: davidosborne
That was a big rally yesterday. Alan Keyes showed up. The myth of separation of church and state as interpreted by the aclu makes me cringe. The Ten Commandments in and of themselves do not establish a religion. They are the best rules for a civilized society to live by whether somebody's a Christian or not. Judge Moore's right to stand up for state's rights.

Can Judges like Thompson be impeached or recalled? Anybody know?

92 posted on 08/17/2003 8:33:55 PM PDT by floriduh voter (http://www.conservative-spirit.org/)
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Comment #93 Removed by Moderator

To: Aunt Enna; All
Aunt Enna,

With all due respect, the issue is MUCH LARGER than the "stone slab" as you put it..... I wish you could see the AGENDA of the left that is being FORCED down our throats, at the same time WE are being told that we are "INTOLLERANT".... this is EXTREMELY important.. please do not be decieved into thinking that its all about ONE man, (Judge Moore)...... Judge Moore represents MILLIONS of us that oppose the liberals attempt to remove the very foundation of Nation that makes us strong.....

IMHO, I believe the Lord looks very favorably on those who stand up for the Principles that our nation was founded on.... and I, for one, put Judge Moore in that category...

David C. Osborne

94 posted on 08/18/2003 3:34:41 PM PDT by davidosborne (www.davidosborne.net)
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To: davidosborne
Exactly.
95 posted on 08/18/2003 8:00:06 PM PDT by dalebert
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Comment #96 Removed by Moderator

To: .30Carbine
During the civil rights marches and public dissent era Martin Luther King, Jr. spent time in the Birmingham jail because he refused to comply with a lawful, albeit ultimately determined unconstitutional, court order. Notwithstanding the correctness of King's historic protest and the patently unconstitutional nature of the law which he protested, he was, just as are all of us, obligated to comply with the order of a court of appropriate jurisdiction unless and until that court order is reversed by a court exercising the power of judicial review.

Chief Justice Moore is 100% wrong and he full-well knows it. If the court of last resort ultimately determines that he is correct in his litigational theory and argument, he can then, and only then, follow the course of conduct he chooses. Until then he must comply with the order of the U.S. District Judge as affirmed by the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals.

When he unilaterally opted to disregard what on its face is a lawful order issuing from a court having jurisdiction of the subject matter and jurisdiction over his person, he deserves to follow M.L. King to the jail and spend time there for wilful contempt.

We are a nation and society of laws not men. I'd bet a year's pay that Chief Justice Moore has said that himself when admonishing a scofflaw for disregarding a court's lawful order to do something or to refrain from doing something, the latter in the nature of an injunction.

I have great respect for the judicial office of Chief Justice and the robes worn by the Chief Justice that represent 450 years of Anglo-American common law and constitutional tradition. In court I would address him with the deference due his office and the respect due his place in the common law heritage we enjoy.

However,regarding Justice Moore as a person who considers himself above the law of the land, the law that we have all contracted amongst ourselves to comply with and adhere to, Justice Moore is worthy of no greater respect or deference than the men with whom he should be sharing a cell in the federal lockup for being in contempt of the courts in whom we place trust to interpret and apply our law; whether constitutional, statutory or unwritten common law. He is a dispicable law-breaker and unworthy of the robes that hang in his chambers.

This fellow Moore is due precisely that which we attribute to any other person within the jurisdiction of our courts and law who believes that he is not bound by the law that binds each of us, the law that governs our conduct as a nation, a people, the law that he has taken an oath to uphold, protect and defend. This fellow Moore is worse than the moron who sticks a gun in the face of a convenience store clerk and steals a hundred bucks from the cash register. At least that criminal portrays exactly what he is and doesn't hide behind the cloak of a judicial robe. While, to the contrary, Moore not only knows better because he's been trained in the very law he flagrantly breaches or because he has benefited from the public education of one of our service academies and has had the faith and trust of the nation reposed in him as a military officer and ultimately as a judicial officer whom we honor and trust to hold high and enforce our laws, he is a far worse criminal than the convenience store robber.

Moore steals from all of us the ideal of a nation under law. He's the model for the next generation's law breaker who believes that obdience to our law is a matter of individual subjectivity; obey those you like and flaunt those you choose to disregard as not agreeing with your personal philosophy or whim.

There should be a special place in the lower regions for public officials like judges, police officers, and others in whom we repose our faith and trust to govern and enforce the law when they do the contrary. Moore fits that description in every regard.

97 posted on 08/19/2003 5:04:35 PM PDT by middie
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To: middie
I agree with you 100%.
98 posted on 08/19/2003 5:13:57 PM PDT by Diverdogz
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To: middie
I would respectfully disagree.... the Court OVERSTEPED its authority when it issued an ILLEGAL order... The judged who issued that order should be impeached and Judge Moore is obligated to uphold his OATH... Common Sense MUST prevail here....

Respectfully,

David
99 posted on 08/20/2003 7:14:50 PM PDT by davidosborne (www.davidosborne.net)
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To: AZ GRAMMY
ping..
100 posted on 08/20/2003 7:54:27 PM PDT by davidosborne (www.davidosborne.net)
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