Bye, Bye Beringia (8,000 Year Old Site In Florida)

Explore North ^ | 8-12-2003 | Bill Jones

[GOPJ]

bump

[blam]

If you like this sort of stuff, I highly recommend this book: Eden In The East

Click on the link and scroll down to the editoral review. Very unique and interesting book.

[blam]

"I saw the headline and thought that it was talking about a Buddha, a man, preserved for 1,300 years. Now that would have impressed me!"

Thought you may like these 8,000 year old folks in this article.

[Rebelbase]

"The ancient human DNA is of such quality as to allow genetic cloning, "

[muawiyah]

The X-Factor genes are found in modern North American Indians ~ as well as in North African Berbers and Fenno-Scandian Sa'ami.

There's a discovery in Oregon (other than Kennewick Man) that's something like 13,000 years old ~ and some quite entertaining Korean-style heated home-sites in Alaska that predate such devices in Korea.

I don't think anyone is quite sure of who was first, but the process has clearly been additive ~ and is still going on.

[muawiyah]

Blam, remember, if you have teeth from the upper-jaw your finding of Jomon is set. Without those teeth everything is less than definitive.

[muawiyah]

Wiigwaasabak - just had an interesting little read trying to find out if any new work had been done on North American Indian writing/record-keeping systems.

[blam]

"The X-Factor genes are found in modern North American Indians ~ as well as in North African Berbers and Fenno-Scandian Sa'ami.
"There's a discovery in Oregon (other than Kennewick Man) that's something like 13,000 years old ~ and some quite entertaining Korean-style heated home-sites in Alaska that predate such devices in Korea."

"I don't think anyone is quite sure of who was first, but the process has clearly been additive ~ and is still going on."

There's some recent DNA data from the Oregon sample, I believe...quite interesting. SunkenCiv may be able to provide links to the articles.

The religious folks finally got CoyoteMan (PhD Archaeology) to say something that got him banned...He's no longer on FR. He can be found at Darwin Central as Coyote.

[muawiyah]

Gee Whiz, must have missed that ~ just posted to CoyoteMan a couple of days ago.

Maybe the Admins relented.

[blam]

"The X-Factor genes are found in modern North American Indians ~ as well as in North African Berbers and Fenno-Scandian Sa'ami."

Notice that professor Oppenheimer's studies (Journey Of Mankind) places humans at Meadowcroft 25,000 years ago where they become isolated during the LGM. I suspect these are the haplogroup X folks.

[PapaBear3625]

There's some recent DNA data from the Oregon sample, I believe...quite interesting. SunkenCiv may be able to provide links to the articles.

I'd be interested in what info there is on this. I'm fascinated at the idea that early proto-Europeans were the real first Americans.

[blam]

"I'd be interested in what info there is on this. I'm fascinated at the idea that early proto-Europeans were the real first Americans. "

I'm not sure who these folks are but they aren't the people we were taught about when I was in school.

Vintage Skulls

"The oldest human remains found in the Americas were recently "discovered" in the storeroom of Mexico's National Museum of Anthropology. Found in central Mexico in 1959, the five skulls were radiocarbon dated by a team of researchers from the United Kingdom and Mexico and found to be 13,000 years old. They pre-date the Clovis culture by a couple thousand years, adding to the growing evidence against the Clovis-first model for the first peopling of the Americas.

"Of additional significance is the shape of the skulls, which are described as long and narrow, very unlike those of modern Native Americans.

[muawiyah]

Note to self ~ that thread where Coyoteman is sending a message to JR was one I thought deserving of no more than a couple of dozen posts. It looks like it got up to 1200 posts.

Must have been a cold and snowy day.

Frankly, ever since they worked out ways of developing the genome, and then discovered gazillions of free genes just floating around at sea in viruses, I've become convinced we are just at the very bottom of a vast body of research into genetics that's going to lead to conclusions 20 years from now we cannot even now begin to imagine.

Now, back to this thread ~ first folks here ~ and I think Blam's got it right ~ the Sa'ami (Sa'ami predecessors actually) should have been able to get to North America over the ice as far back as 35,000 years ago ~ that's when the folks were painting pictures of walruses in caves in France (which was then a very long way from the sea).

However, we know those painters still had an African body type ~ you can tell that by figuring out how tall and lithe the guys were who put their handprints on the ceilings.

It may be been entirely too rigorous for such folks to cross the North Atlantic ~ too many body type changes to get done. Even 25,000 years back may have been too soon.

BTW, point I'd like to make is that Charles Darwin comes into this picture. He had what seems to be an arrhythmic heart beat typical of the type you can get with any one of three genes that cause porphyria almost exclusively in Sa'ami (and related Scandinavians).

He also seemed to have a lifelong pattern of "suffering" from bouts of diarrhea more typical of being infected by a parasite than anything ~ but certainly typical of having one of the 12 known genes for Celiac disease (all typically found in higher percentages in Sa'ami than any other group, with one such gene actually traceable to Sa'ami).

When Charles lived in town he'd suffer and when he went to the country he'd get relief. I think the difference is due simply to his consumption of bread in town (bakeries were commonly found there) and potatoes and vegetables in the country.

Celiac is an intolerance of wheat gluten BTW, and bread's a killer.

Then there's the mysterious Unidentifiable Infertility of several of his offspring.

One theory is that such infertility in offspring is due to the presence of a certain X chromosome in the mother, and a certain Y chromosome in the father. The Y provides a certain "extra vigor" to the sperm making them more motile and thereby more fertile.

As long as you aren't having babies by a first cousin (who has that X chromosome that kind of helps produce that extra motility) your kids will be OK. However, if you have babies by a first cousin with that particular X chromosome, you will have a 50/50 chance of having infertile offspring.

Gee whiz, that's what Charles Darwin's kids were like.

These Sa'ami "get away with living in the cold" special genes also have a high incidence of occurrence in the Orkneys.

Those folks, in turn, are tied into every royal and noble family in Europe. Charles Darwin's wife's mother's family appear to be part of that line ~ since all inquiries into her family genealogy take you directly to "the family" ~ all the way back to King Frosti.

I suspect Charles' voyage to the Galapagos provided him considerable relief since they subsisted on foods other than grains.

Otherwise, he was sick all the time in lower latitude society. Made him unsocial ~ virtually a recluse ~ and his heart palpitations and arrhythmia's would send him to bed for months. Then there were the times when the porphyria would get to him ~ and thank the Lord I don't have that problem (beyond a little excess iron excretion on a seasonal basis).

Now, getting back to the point at hand ~ Charles Darwin is a good example of a highly evolved human being ~ he was COLD ADAPTED. Unfortunately he lived in a time and age where he would not have known that ~ he and others who knew of his problems would simply believe that he was sick with some sort of parasite he may have acquired in South America wading around in the Amazon.

Others of his tribe, the early Clovis people, were undoubtedly similarly evolved, but they wouldn't have known that either. Unfortunately for them, they were so Cold Adapted they could live at the foot of the glaciers, so when the comet or meteor hit the residual ice cap in Canada some 9500 years ago (creating the Younger Dryas), they were all huddled together in the wrong place and were wiped out.

[muawiyah]

There's considerable debate over skull shapes having any significance ~ seems that they change back and forth randomly over a long enough period of time.

I've looked for some specific studies on the net without success, but this factoid shows up regularly.

It is believable.

At the same time, the Clovis people could very well have had African skulls, so maybe these guys were Clovis.

Be good to find bones associated with the artifacts.

[blam]

I thought the comet strike was 12,900 years ago?

Anyway, you'll like this: Neanderthal Genome To Be Unveiled

[muawiyah]

Younger Dyras = 12800 years before present. So, 10,800 BC.

Lasted just under 1400 years, or until 9400 BC.

I think I flipped the end number to the beginning of the thought process.

Next big item on the agenda is BLACK LAKE FLOODS (7600 years before present), and then SAHARA DESERT PLUVIAL ENDS (5500 years before present).

There, all the big news since the end of the last Great Glaciation in one concise paragraph.

If it's not one thing it's another.

I'm still shooting for some confirmation of a vast soliton at the end of the first stage of the Antarctic meltdown ~ this would wipe everything anywhere within 500 miles of the ocean "clean".

[SunkenCiv]

I’d be shakin’ my finger at all of you for pulling me back into such an old topic — if I weren’t the usual culprit for doing just that. ;’)

Prehistoric Oregon latrine trove of fossil DNA
AP | 21 Sep 2008 | Jeff Barnard
Posted on 09/22/2008 2:06:38 PM PDT by BGHater
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2087951/posts

How Did People Reach the Americas?
US News | July 24, 2008 | Andrew Curry
Posted on 07/27/2008 10:12:03 AM PDT by SunkenCiv
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/2052126/posts

Oregon Discovery Challenges Beliefs About First Humans
PBS | 7-1-2008 | Lee Hochberg
Posted on 07/01/2008 8:20:04 PM PDT by blam
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2039558/posts

[SunkenCiv]

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[PapaBear3625]

Thank you, SunkenCiv!

[SunkenCiv]

My pleasure!